Dec 19, 2023 Planning & Zoning Commission

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EVERYONE IT IS 6:00.

[1.CALL TO ORDER]

FIRST ITEM IS GOING TO BE THE INVOCATION.

DAVID, CAN YOU LEAD US, PLEASE? FATHER, WE THANK YOU FOR YOUR LOVE, AND, LORD, WE ASK THAT TONIGHT THAT YOU'LL GRANT US SOME OF YOUR WISDOM AND YOUR PATIENCE AS WE DELIBERATE AND WE LOOK AT THE ISSUES THAT ARE BEFORE US TONIGHT.

FATHER, WE'RE THANKFUL FOR THE FOLKS THAT ARE HERE THAT SERVE, THAT GIVE THEIR TIME, AND WE PRAY THAT YOU'LL CONTINUE TO BLESS THEM AS WE LOOK AT THIS CHRISTMAS SEASON.

FOR IT'S IN YOUR NAME WE PRAY.

AMEN. PLEASE STAND FOR THE PLEDGE.

ALL RIGHT, FIRST THINGS FIRST CITIZEN APPEARANCES.

THIS IS A TIME WHERE ANYONE IN THE AUDIENCE CAN COME TO SPEAK ON ANYTHING THAT IS NOT LISTED IN A PUBLIC HEARING.

SO I'LL OPEN IT UP FOR ANYONE THAT WISHES TO SPEAK.

ALL RIGHT. SEEING NONE, WE WILL MOVE ON TO THE CONSENT AGENDA.

[3. CONSENT AGENDA]

UNLESS SOMEONE FROM THE AUDIENCE, COMMISSION OR STAFF WOULD LIKE TO PULL AN ITEM.

OTHERWISE, I'LL ENTERTAIN A MOTION.

MOTION TO APPROVE.

SECOND. YOU GOT IT.

I HAVE A MOTION BY CLINT AND A SECOND BY TODD.

ALL IN FAVOR, RAISE YOUR HANDS.

ALL RIGHT.

ALL RIGHT. NOW WE'LL MOVE ON TO THE PUBLIC HEARING THAT WE HAVE TONIGHT.

[4.A.Burleson Retail Summercrest at 700 Wilshire Blvd (Case 23-252): Hold a public hearing and consider approval of a resolution for a commercial site plan with a variance to Chapter 36, fencing and screening regulations, allowing for an alternative transitional screening material. (Staff Presenter: JP Ducay, Senior Planner)]

HOLD A PUBLIC HEARING AND CONSIDER APPROVAL OF A RESOLUTION FOR A COMMERCIAL SITE PLAN WITH A VARIANCE TO CHAPTER 36 FENCING AND SCREENING REGULATIONS ALLOWING FOR AN ALTERNATIVE TRANSITIONAL SCREENING MATERIAL.

JP DUCAY IS THE STAFF PRESENTER.

MR. CHAIR, I'M SORRY JP, I'M GOING TO JUMP IN REAL QUICK.

WE CONTINUED THIS ITEM FROM OUR LAST MEETING AND SO WHAT WE'LL NEED TO DO INITIALLY IS TAKE A MOTION TO REMOVE CASE 23-252 FROM THE TABLE FOR CONSIDERATION. SO WE'LL NEED A MOTION TO REMOVE IT FROM THE TABLE THIS CASE 23-252 FROM THE TABLE SO WE CAN BEGIN THE PRESENTATION.

DOES THAT MAKE SENSE? I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO REMOVE CASE 23-252 FROM THE TABLE.

I'LL SECOND. ALL RIGHT.

I HAVE A MOTION BY MICHAEL AND A SECOND BY ASHLEY.

ALL IN FAVOR, RAISE YOUR HAND.

ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN. MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION FOR THE RECORD, J.P.

DUCAY DEVELOPMENT SERVICES, PRESENTING CASE 23-52.

IT'S A COMMERCIAL SITE PLAN WITH A FENCE VARIANCE.

THE APPLICANT IS ANNA CARRILLO.

THE SUBJECT PROPERTY IS APPROXIMATELY 2.64 ACRES AND IS LOCATED AT 700 SOUTHWEST WILSHIRE, AND AS THE CITY ATTORNEY HAD POINTED OUT, THIS IS AN ITEM THAT WE RECENTLY DISCUSSED THE NOVEMBER 14TH PLANNING AND ZONING MEETING, AND IT WAS TABLED TO A LATER DATE BEING TODAY AND THE REASON FOR THAT TABLING WAS TO ALLOW FOR THE APPLICANT TO COORDINATE WITH THE OWNERS AND RENTERS OF THE SURROUNDING AREA IN REGARDS TO THIS, FENCE VARIANCE REQUEST.

I WILL RUN THROUGH THE SLIDES FOR YOU ONCE AGAIN JUST TO REFRESH EVERYONE'S MEMORIES, AND THEN WE CAN OPEN IT UP FOR CONTINUED DISCUSSION.

SO AS FOR THE SITE PLAN, PLEASE BE AWARE YOU KNOW THIS IS POTENTIALLY SUBJECT TO CHANGE, BUT IT IS BROKEN DOWN INTO TWO LOTS, LOT A AND LOT B.

YOU CAN SEE ON LOT A, THERE IS A PROPOSED BUILDING OF 3269FT².

IT WILL BE ONE-STORY, ROUGHLY 26FT, AND THE USE OF THAT SITE WILL BE FOR A RESTAURANT WITH A DRIVE-THRU, AND THEN FOR LOT B, WE'RE LOOKING AT A PROPOSED BUILDING OF ROUGHLY 7000FT², ONE-STORY PROPOSED HEIGHT OF 25FT, AND THE USES WILL BE THAT OF RESTAURANT, DRIVE-THRU, REGULAR RESTAURANT AND POTENTIALLY RETAIL, AND IT CURRENTLY IS PROPOSING THREE TENANT SPACES, AND THEN OF COURSE, A VARIANCE REQUEST FOR THE TRANSITIONAL SCREENING.

SO AS FOR A BACKGROUND, THE FENCING AND SCREENING REGULATION STATES THAT TRANSITIONAL SCREENING SHALL BE REQUIRED WHEN NONRESIDENTIAL USES ABUT RESIDENTIAL USES, AND IT IS INCUMBENT IN THOSE SITUATIONS UPON THE DEVELOPER OF THE MORE INTENSELY ZONED DISTRICT TO SCREEN THEIR PROPERTY FROM THE LESS INTENSIVE ZONE DISTRICT, AND SO IN THIS PARTICULAR CASE, YOU CAN SEE THE SUBJECT SITE IS ZONED GENERAL RETAIL AND THE ADJACENT PROPERTY IS ZONED SF-7.

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ALL OTHER DESIGNS AND MATERIALS WILL HAVE TO BE APPROVED BY THE DEVELOPMENT ASSISTANCE COMMITTEE, PROVIDED THE SCREENING MEETS THE INTENT OF THIS SECTION.

THE APPLICANT HAD ORIGINALLY PROPOSED AN ALTERNATIVE SCREENING MATERIAL DURING THE COMMERCIAL SITE PLAN REVIEW PROCESS, AND THE DEVELOPMENT ASSISTANCE COMMITTEE DENIED THAT REQUEST AT THAT TIME.

THE APPLICANT HAS NOW APPEALED THAT REQUEST AND IS APPEALING THAT DETERMINATION FOR CITY COUNCIL CONSIDERATION.

UPON THE RECOMMENDATION BY THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION.

SO AGAIN, THAT REQUEST IS TO ALLOW FOR THE TRANSITIONAL SCREENING TO BE AN EIGHT FOOT WOODEN FENCE IN-LIEU OF A MASONRY SCREENING WALL, AND THE APPLICANT'S JUSTIFICATION FOR THAT IS THAT THE PROPOSED WOODEN FENCE WOULD BE LESS OBTRUSIVE THAN A MASONRY WALL, GIVEN THAT THE FENCE AND SCREENING WALL WILL BE LOCATED WITHIN A UTILITY EASEMENT AND AN OVERHEAD ELECTRIC LINE, AND THAT THE WOODEN FENCE SATISFIES THE INTENT OF THE ORDINANCE BY PROVIDING ADEQUATE SCREENING FROM THE DEVELOPMENT TO THE RESIDENTIAL LOTS, AND IS A SIGNIFICANT IMPROVEMENT FROM THE EXISTING CONDITIONS.

THESE ARE THE FENCING AND SCREENING CODE CRITERIA, ESSENTIALLY CONDITIONS THAT SHOULD BE CONSIDERED WHEN MAKING A DETERMINATION ABOUT A FENCE OR SCREEN VARIANCE OR WAIVER. AS FOR THE SITE CONFORMANCE, ALL OF THE DEVELOPMENT STANDARDS ARE CURRENTLY BEING MET AND ARE CURRENTLY BEING COMPLIED WITH, WITH THE EXCEPTION OF THAT TRANSITIONAL SCREENING REQUEST.

SO THE LOT SIZE COVERAGE SETBACKS ARE IN COMPLIANCE, THE LANDSCAPING IN COMPLETE COMPLIANCE, AND THEN FOR THE PARKING REQUIREMENT THAT'S CURRENTLY BEING ACCOMMODATED WITH THE CURRENT SITE PLAN CONCEPT.

AS FOR PUBLIC HEARING NOTICES.

PUBLIC NOTICES WERE MAILED TO PROPERTY OWNERS WITHIN 300FT OF THE SUBJECT PROPERTY.

THERE WAS A NOTICE PUBLISHED IN THE NEWSPAPER AND AS FOR SURROUNDING AREA RESPONSE STAFF HAS RECEIVED ONE LETTER OF INTEREST FROM A PROPERTY OWNER WITHIN 300FT OF THE SUBJECT SITE, AND I NOTED ON HERE THAT THEY DIDN'T PROPOSE EITHER SUPPORT OR OPPOSITION.

THIS WAS AN EXHIBIT THAT I INCLUDED IN YOUR PACKETS, AND REALLY, THE LETTER KIND OF STATED THAT THEY WERE COMFORTABLE WITH EITHER P&Z OR CITY COUNCIL MAKING THE DETERMINATION THEY COULD LIVE WITH WHATEVER THAT DETERMINATION WOULD BE.

I WILL SAY IT IS MY UNDERSTANDING THAT THE APPLICANT HAS BEEN COORDINATING WITH THE SURROUNDING AREA, HAS HAD SOME ONGOING CONVERSATIONS.

I HAVEN'T NECESSARILY BEEN INVOLVED IN THAT PROCESS, AND SO LIKELY AT THE END OF MY PRESENTATION, WE CAN TURN IT OVER TO THE APPLICANT TO PROVIDE THAT INFORMATION TO YOU.

AS FOR STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION, THE DAC DID DENY THAT ALTERNATIVE FENCING MATERIAL ORIGINALLY WHEN WE RE REVIEWING THE COMMERCIAL SITE PLAN, AND THE REASON FOR THAT DENIAL WAS DUE TO THE POTENTIAL DETRIMENTAL IMPACTS TO THE ADJACENT RESIDENTIAL HOMES, SOME OF THOSE SPECIFICALLY BEING THE LOCATION AND PROXIMITY OF THE DRIVE-THRU AND THE DUMPSTER COULD POTENTIALLY CAUSE SOME EXCESSIVE NUISANCE OF NOISE AND LIGHTS, POTENTIALLY.

HOWEVER, STAFF DOES ACKNOWLEDGE THAT THE SCREENING WILL BE LOCATED WITHIN THE UTILITY EASEMENT, AND FUTURE EASEMENT ACCESSIBILITY SHOULD DEFINITELY BE CONSIDERED, BUT WITH THAT, THAT IS THE END OF MY PRESENTATION.

MYSELF AND THE APPLICANT ARE AVAILABLE FOR ANY QUESTIONS.

THANK YOU, JP.

THIS IS A PUBLIC HEARING, SO I'LL OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING AT 6:09.

I DO HAVE A SPEAKER CARD.

TONY FILLEY FROM RETAIL PARTNERS.

YES, SIR. DO YOU HAVE ANYTHING TO SAY OR YOU JUST WANT TO ANSWER SOME QUESTIONS AS THEY COME? ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS THAT COUNCIL MAY HAVE.

OKAY. IS THERE ANYONE ELSE THAT WISHES TO SPEAK ON THIS ITEM? TONY, IF YOU WANT TO GO AHEAD AND COME UP HERE, I'M SURE THE COMMISSION WILL HAVE SOME QUESTIONS.

YES, SIR. TONY FILLEY RETAIL PARTNERS, 2525 MCKINNON.

SO I UNDERSTAND THAT YOU'VE BEEN IN COMMUNICATION WITH, I'M ASSUMING, THE NEIGHBORING PROPERTIES BEHIND YOU.

WELL, AS I, AS WE HAD AN AGREEMENT LAST TIME WE WERE IN P&Z, I REACHED OUT TO ALL FIVE OF THE OWNERS OF THE PROPERTY.

WE'VE ACTUALLY MADE CONTACT WITH THREE OF THOSE OWNERS, THE SHIPPING COMPANIES, MRS. SCOTT AND MR. SMITH, WHICH ALL OF THEM APPROVED OUR PROPOSED VARIANTS TO THE FENCING.

I HAVE NOT I HAVE NOT BEEN ABLE TO GET AHOLD OF MR.

[00:10:01]

OKAY. THANK YOU.

ANY OTHER COMMISSIONERS HAVE COMMENTS? WELL, I JUST WANT TO SAY SOMETHING TO EVERYBODY.

LAST MEETING AND I WANT TO APOLOGIZE TO YOU SPECIFICALLY AND TO THE COMMISSIONERS AND TO STAFF.

LAST MEETING I WAS IN AN INTERNAL RAGE THAT DAY.

IT HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH ANYTHING GOING ON IN HERE.

IT HAD MORE TO DO WITH WHAT IS GOING ON, OVERSEAS AND SOME OF THE SPILLOVER INTO OUR OWN NATION WHEN I, AFTER WEARING OUR UNIFORM FOR 39 YEARS, THE PEOPLE IN OUR OWN COUNTRY, WHO BELIEVE VERY STRONGLY THAT THE MURDER AND RAPE AND BABY BEHEADING TERRORISTS FROM HAMAS ARE THE GOOD GUYS CAUSED ME TO REFLECT ON MY OWN TIME IN THE MIDDLE EAST AND THAT PARTICULAR DAY, I WAS KIND OF SCREWED INTO THE CEILING.

IT MIGHT NOT HAVE BEEN OBVIOUS TO EVERYBODY, BUT, YOU KNOW, MY APOLOGIES TO EVERYBODY AND TO YOU AND TO YOUR ENGINEER FOR COMING OFF LIKE A WELL, A COLOSSAL JERK TO JUST PUT IT POLITELY.

IN ANOTHER SETTING I WOULD USE A LONGER, LONGER WORD.

SO PLEASE ACCEPT MY APOLOGIES IF YOU'RE THERE, AND THAT'S NOT AN EXCUSE.

IT'S JUST BY WAY OF EXPLANATION, AND I, YOU KNOW, I RETURNED FROM THE MIDDLE EAST IN JANUARY 2010.

IT'S BEEN A LONG TIME NOW, BUT IT STILL CAUSES ME SOME TIME TO SOMETIMES TO WONDER WHAT THE HECK WAS ALL THAT BLOOD AND TREASURE SPENT ON WHEN IT SEEMS LIKE IN OUR OWN COUNTRY, THE BAD GUYS ACTUALLY HAVE WON? SO THAT'S WHAT IT WAS.

IT HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH YOU OR THIS OR ANYTHING ELSE.

SO MY APOLOGIES ALL THE WAY AROUND.

SO I JUST WANTED TO LET YOU KNOW THAT AND LET THE COMMISSIONERS AND THE STAFF KNOW THAT AS WELL.

WELL, APOLOGY ACCEPTED, AND I CERTAINLY UNDERSTAND YOUR PASSION AND I APPRECIATE YOUR PASSION.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR SERVICE.

I COME FROM A MILITARY BACKGROUND AS WELL, SO I CERTAINLY UNDERSTAND SOME OF YOUR FRUSTRATION.

YEAH, I KNOW HE WAS A PASSIONATE MAN.

I MEAN, LIKE, ME TOO, SOMETIMES I'VE SPOKEN STUFF, AND I DIDN'T HOLD ANYTHING AGAINST IT.

I KNEW THAT SOME OF THE OTHER ONES THAT DIDN'T KNOW OR UNDERSTAND YOUR PASSION MIGHT SEE IT OTHERWISE, BUT I APPRECIATE YOU SPEAKING UP WITH THAT APOLOGY.

THANK YOU.

LAST TIME I ALLUDED TO A COUPLE OF CONCERNS.

I'D MENTIONED ABOUT THE SEWER LINE LOCATION.

THE APPROXIMATE DEPTH OF IT IS YOUR FACILITY.

THE BUILDING IS GOING TO BE USING THE SAME EXISTING SEWER LINE.

OR IS IT GOING TO BE TAPPING IN SOMEWHERE ELSE? I DON'T KNOW IF MICHELLE, IF YOU KNOW, THE SEWER LINE, ARE THEY GOING TO BE USING THAT SAME SEWER LINE? IT'S GOING TO BE RIGHT THERE IN THAT EASEMENT.

OKAY, AND YOU WERE SAYING LAST TIME YOU THOUGHT THAT IT MAY BE TWO FEET DEEP OR SO.

IT'S ANYWHERE BETWEEN 4 TO 6FT.

OKAY. 4 TO 6. OKAY. [INAUDIBLE] FURTHER DOWNSTREAM IT GETS A LITTLE DEEPER.

RIGHT OKAY, AND THAT MAKES SENSE BECAUSE EITHER WAY, WITH THE WOOD FENCE OR WITH THE CEMENT DOING FOOTERS, THEY WOULD HAVE TO BE ABOUT A THIRD TO DEPTH AT LEAST 32 TO 36IN MAYBE, YOU KNOW, EVEN CLOSE TO 40.

SO THAT WOULD BE NOT A PROBLEM THERE GREASE TRAPS, ARE THEY LOCATED SOMEWHERE IN THAT SAME.

THEY'RE NOT GOING TO BE IN THAT SAME VICINITY.

THEY'RE GOING TO BE CLOSER TO THE BUILDING.

OKAY, AND THE LESS OBTRUSIVE EITHER EITHER FENCE I CAN PART OF MY PROBLEM IS GOING TO BE IF YOU LEAVE THE EXISTING FENCE UP AND THEN PUT ANOTHER WOODEN ONE UP THERE, I SEE A PROBLEM WITH MAINTENANCE OR THE DEAD MAN'S LAND THAT'S GOING TO BE IN BETWEEN.

I DON'T KNOW IF. WELL, THAT'S SORT OF NO PUN INTENDED, BUT THAT'S THE MILLION DOLLAR QUESTION, RIGHT? BECAUSE WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO BUILD THAT MASONRY WALL.

IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING FIVE FEET OFF THAT PROPERTY LINE AND THAT'S FIVE FEET OF PROPERTY THAT I'M LOSING.

I PAID FOR NUMBER ONE, AND NUMBER TWO, THE QUESTION IS WHO'S GOING TO WHO'S GOING TO MAINTAIN THAT FIVE FOOT GAP, AND IF YOU GO BACK TO THOSE THOSE PICTURES, TWO OF THOSE HOMES HAVE CHAIN LINK FENCES.

SO IF YOU PUT UP A MASONRY WALL THERE AND YOU HAVE A FIVE FOOT GAP BETWEEN THE WALL AND THOSE CHAIN LINK FENCES, I THINK WE ALL KNOW WHAT CAN POSSIBLY HAPPEN THERE.

OUR PROPOSAL IS TO BUILD EVERYONE A BRAND NEW FENCE.

I'VE TOLD MRS. SCOTT, THE SHIPPING COMPANIES, MR. SMITH, WERE MORE THAN HAPPY TO PROVIDE YOU WITH THE ELEVATIONS TO GET ANY FEEDBACK ON THE FENCE THAT WE'RE PROPOSING TO BUILD, AND WE'D INCORPORATE THOSE CHANGES INTO THE

[00:15:05]

YEAH BACK INTO THAT, I AGREE.

IF THE OTHER FENCE COULD COME DOWN WHERE YOU COULD BUILD AROUND IT, I THINK THAT WOULD BE THE BEST THING.

YOU GOT A COUPLE TREES IN A WAY.

YOU HAVE TO BOX OUT. SO IT IS GOING TO ENCROACH YOUR DIRECTION OR BACKWARDS PART OF MY CONCERNS ARE WOULD IT BE BOARD ON BOARD WOOD FENCE? YES, SIR. OKAY AND I BELIEVE IT WAS ONE INCH PICKETS.

YES, SIR. OKAY NOISE AND LIGHTS, AND I KNOW IF YOU GO EIGHT FOOT MASONRY OR EIGHT FOOT WOOD, YOU HAVE THE CHANCE OF NOISE REVERBING EITHER WAY.

HOW MANY CARS FOR EACH ESTABLISHMENT COULD POSSIBLY BE IN LINE AT ONE TIME? WELL, NOW THAT ONE, I DON'T THE MORE THE MERRIER.

QUITE FRANKLY, IS THE OBVIOUS ANSWER, RIGHT? I MEAN, THAT'S WHAT EVERYONE WOULD WOULD WANT TO HEAR, AND I THINK INCLUDING THE COUNCIL BECAUSE IT'S OBVIOUSLY GENERATING MORE TAXABLE SALES, BUT I DON'T WITHOUT HAVING THE SPECIFIC TENANTS HERE WITH US I COULDN'T GIVE YOU A REAL NUMBER.

I WOULDN'T GUESS PROBABLY ANY MORE THAN 3 OR 4, MAYBE POSSIBLY FIVE, I WOULD THINK.

I MEAN, THEY'RE RUNNING THEM THROUGH THERE PRETTY QUICK.

I MEAN, THEY'RE NOT THERE'S NOT MUCH OF A STANDSTILL QUITE FRANKLY.

YEAH BECAUSE SOME OF THESE ESTABLISHMENTS YOU CAN DRIVE-THRU AND YOU MIGHT SEE 20 VEHICLES IN THERE, AND IT'S LIKE THAT CONSTANT FOR HOURS.

YEAH. YEAH. PRETTY MUCH.

WELL IF WE COULD GET A CHICK-FIL-A ON THE SITE I WOULD CERTAINLY DO IT, BUT THEY TOLD ME NO.

OH YEAH. YEAH I UNDERSTAND AND I'M LOOKING FORWARD TO THE BUSINESSES COMING.

I'M LOOKING FORWARD TO EATING THERE AND I'M PUTTING ON SOME WEIGHT THERE [CHUCKLING] BUT I CAN TELL YOU BY MY OWN PERSONAL.

I LIVED IN AN APARTMENT ONE TIME, FOR ABOUT A YEAR, IT WAS RIGHT BEHIND TSC, AND THAT TRASH TRUCK WOULD SHOW UP AT 3:30, 4:00, 4:30 IN THE MORNING, WHAM, WHAM, SLAM THAT CONTAINER.

IT GOT TO WHERE WITHIN A MONTH OR TWO, I COULD HEAR IT TWO MILES DOWN THE ROAD.

YES, SIR, AND IT IRRITATED ME AND I DIDN'T HEAR IT.

MY SLEEP, I HEARD IT, I MAY OR MAY NOT HAVE A COUPLE TIMES.

GOT OUT THERE AND TOSSED A SOFTBALL OR TWO OVER THE FENCE TO GET MY ATTENTION, BUT IT FINALLY GOT TO WHERE I HAD TO CALL THE POLICE.

THEY VIOLATED NOISE ORDINANCE.

THE GUY GOT A TICKET AND IT WASN'T HIS FAULT.

I CALLED HIM DIRECT AND JUST SAID, HEY, IF THIS GETS THE MESSAGE ACROSS, DON'T SHOW UP BEFORE 6 A.M.

BY THEN I'M GONE, I DON'T CARE, AND THAT'S WHAT HE DID.

HE WAS ABLE TO REROUTE IT, BUT I'M WORRIED ABOUT SOME OF THESE PEOPLE.

MISS SCOTT, I KNOW HER HUSBAND I USED TO DO GET HIM TO DO MY KEYS SCOTT'S LOCK AND KEY A LONG TIME AGO BUT THAT'S MY MAIN CONCERN IS THE NOISE.

QUITE FRANKLY, AND I THINK WHEN SOMEONE MENTIONED IT EARLIER, WHETHER IT'S A MASONRY WALL OR A BOARD ON BOARD FENCE, THAT'S NOT GOING TO THAT'S NOT GOING TO STOP THE NOISE THAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT. IT'S GOING TO REVERB ONE WAY OR THE OTHER, AND THAT'S MY CONCERN, BUT YEAH, IF YOU GUYS IF THERE'S SOMETHING I CAN DO TO MAYBE REMOVE THAT FENCE, I WOULD HAVE NO PROBLEM WITH THE BOARD ON BOARD TO ONE INCH CONSTRUCTION.

WELL, AND AND LIKE I TOLD THE THREE INDIVIDUALS I SPOKE WITH WERE I'M GOING TO SEND YOU ELEVATIONS OF WHAT OUR PROPOSED FENCE LOOKS LIKE.

WE'RE OPEN TO ANY AND ALL SUGGESTIONS MOVING FORWARD REGARDING THAT FENCE, AND I'M CERTAINLY NOT HERE TO SAY, NO, WE'RE NOT GOING TO DO THAT.

SO THE DOOR IS OPEN, BUT WE WOULD BE HAPPY TO GET THE APPROVAL BEFORE WE MOVE FORWARD.

YEAH, I UNDERSTAND MASONRY TO MOST YO ME, THE INTEGRITY AND THE STRENGTH I THINK WOULD, YOU KNOW, OUTLAST THAT DOESN'T I CAN ONLY GET SO PRETTY.

I MEAN, I GOT A HAT HERE TO HELP ME LOOK PRETTY, BUT I WOULD BE FINE, LIKE I SAID, WITH WITH THE WOOD.

ALSO, IF IT'S A ONE INCH BOARD ON BOARD, IF I MAY SO I DON'T KNOW EXACTLY WHO TO ASK THE QUESTION TO.

MAYBE YOU IS THERE SOME REASON THAT THIS CHAIN, LINK FENCE AND WOOD FENCE CAN'T BE TORN DOWN? AND PERHAPS IF IT NEEDED A VARIANCE TO BUILD THE CONCRETE FENCE IN THAT PLACE.

WHY? IS THERE SOME REQUIREMENT THAT REQUIRES US TO HAVE THAT NO MAN'S/DEAD MAN'S LAND? THERE'S NOT A REQUIREMENT.

THE ONLY ISSUE IS MAINTENANCE OF THE SEWER LINE.

IF YOU HAVE A MASONRY FENCE THERE, IT'S EASIER TO REMOVE WOOD PANELS WHETHER WHETHER THE MASONRY GOES IN THERE OR NOT.

WHAT WE TOLD THEM IS, [INAUDIBLE] FOR THE MAINTENANCE TO SET THE MASONRY [INAUDIBLE].

SO THE EXISTING FENCE NOW IS I'M ASKING A QUESTION IS DIRECTLY OVER THIS THIS SEWER LINE OR WHATEVER. SO THERE'S NOT AN OPTION FOR THEM TO BUILD THE, THE FENCE BECAUSE I DON'T WANT THEM TO LOSE FIVE FEET OF THEIR LAND.

I GET THAT CONCERN.

I ALSO AM NOT EXCITED AND AM VERY UNLIKELY TO VOTE FOR A WOOD FENCE, BECAUSE I BELIEVE THE MASONRY FENCE IS GOING TO STOP A LOT MORE SOUND GOING INTO THEIR SPACE AT 10:00 MIDNIGHT.

THE LATE NIGHT HOURS WHEN THESE BUSINESSES ARE STILL OPERATING AND HAVE KIDS AND OTHER PEOPLE GOING THROUGH AND SPENDING MONEY THERE, WHICH IS WONDERFUL AND AMAZING, BUT IT'S

[00:20:01]

SO WE DON'T HAVE A DESIGN OF WHAT THAT WOULD LOOK LIKE.

SO I CAN'T ANSWER THAT QUESTION.

OKAY. YEAH. IT IS YOUR TYPICAL MASONRY FENCE WITH, A ROCK, YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT IN ORDER TO REMOVE THAT OR TO GET TO THE SEWER LINE, IT'S NOT EASY.

IF IT'S PANELED, THEN YOU CAN REMOVE IT.

SO IT DEPENDS ON WHAT THEY WILL PROPOSE AND WHAT THEY MEET.

THE INTENT OF THE ORDINANCE.

OKAY, AND I CAN ADD TO THAT.

SO THE CURRENT REQUEST IS IS FOR A WOOD FENCE, AND STAFF HAS THE OPPORTUNITY TO APPROVE THAT ALTERNATIVE SCREENING ADMINISTRATIVELY IF WE FELT COMFORTABLE WITH IT.

DURING THE REVIEW PROCESS, WE DIDN'T FEEL COMFORTABLE WITH THAT, AND SO THAT IS WHY WE'RE GOING THROUGH THE CURRENT PROCESS.

IF THE PROPOSAL WAS TO CHANGE TO A DIFFERENT MATERIAL, MAYBE SOMETHING THAT WE WOULD DETERMINE TO BE A LITTLE BIT MORE IN LINE WITH WHAT THE CODE REQUIRES, THAT IS SOMETHING THAT WOULDN'T EVEN REQUIRE A VARIANCE.

WE COULD APPROVE IT ADMINISTRATIVELY.

THANK YOU. WHAT WOULD THAT BE? WELL, SO AS WE KIND OF MENTIONED A COUPLE OF SLIDES EARLIER, THE CODE REQUIRES ANYTHING THAT IS SOLID MASONRY OR REINFORCED CONCRETE OR SOMETHING THAT THE DEVELOPMENT ASSISTANCE COMMITTEE COULD DEEM AS SOMETHING THAT IS IN GENERAL CONFORMANCE WITH THIS SECTION OF THE CODE, AND SO WHEN WE REVIEWED THIS, WE DIDN'T FEEL THAT THE WOOD PANELING FENCE WAS NEARLY AS COMPLIANT WITH WHAT THE CODE REQUIRED, AND TO BE COMPLETELY HONEST, WE DIDN'T FEEL COMFORTABLE APPROVING A WOODEN FENCE THAT'S GOING TO BE DIRECTLY ABUTTING FIVE RESIDENTIAL PROPERTIES WHEN THE CODE STATES MASONRY, AND SO WE DIDN'T FEEL COMFORTABLE APPROVING THAT ADMINISTRATIVELY.

WE HAD NO ISSUE PROCESSING THAT WAIVER, BUT THAT WAIVER SHOULD BE PROCESSED AND SEEN BY AND SEEN BY THE NECESSARY BODIES, SUCH AS YOURSELF AND CITY COUNCIL.

DO WE HAVE THE AUTHORITY TO APPROVE THE ELIMINATION OF THE FIVE FOOT SETBACK? I GUESS I'M NOT REALLY SURE WHAT YOU'RE ASKING.

WELL, IF HE'S GOT TO STEP OFF FIVE FEET FROM THE PROPERTY LINE TO PUT THE MASONRY IN, DO WE HAVE THE AUTHORITY AS A GROUP TO ALLOW IT TO BE ON THE PROPERTY LINE? IN THIS INSTANCE, THAT IS A FIVE FOOT UTILITY EASEMENT, AND THAT WOULD REQUIRE AN ENCROACHMENT AGREEMENT FOR THE RIGHT OF WAY OR FOR THAT EASEMENT BUT THE FENCE IS SUPPOSED TO BE BUILT ON THE PROPERTY LINE, TECHNICALLY.

MAY I? I'M ANNA CARRILLO.

I'M THE CIVIL ENGINEER, AND I'D JUST LIKE TO ADD THAT THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A WOODEN FENCE, THE FOUNDATION OF IT AND A MASONRY FENCE IS THE FOOTINGS.

SO ON A WOODEN FENCE, YOU HAVE THE POLE THAT WE'RE USED TO SEEING ON THE MASONRY FENCE BECAUSE OF THE WEIGHT THAT NEEDS SOME MORE STRUCTURAL SUPPORT, AND SO YOU HAVE THE FOOTINGS ARE SPACED EVERY TEN FEET OR SO TYPICALLY ARE LIKE TWO BY TWO FOOT COLUMNS.

SO IT BECOMES A LOT MORE INTRUSIVE INTO THAT FIVE FOOT UTILITY EASEMENT, AND WHEN PUBLIC WORKS AND IT HAS TO GO IN THERE TO MAINTAIN THE SEWER LINE, IT'S THAT MUCH MORE DIFFICULT. WHEREAS A WOOD FENCE LIKE MICHELLE WAS MENTIONING EARLIER, YOU CAN JUST REMOVE THE PANELS AND IF NECESSARY, CAN REMOVE THE POST WITHOUT THAT MUCH ACTIVITY OR INTRUSION INTO THE UTILITY EASEMENT.

SO IS THE WOOD FENCE SUBJECT TO THE FIVE FOOT SETBACK AS WELL? NO, SIR.

NONE OF THE FENCES ARE SUBJECT TO ANY SETBACK.

THEY CAN BE TECHNICALLY BUILT ON THE PROPERTY LINE.

MR. CHAIR, IF I MAY.

I THINK IT'S VERY IMPORTANT THAT THE COMMISSION UNDERSTANDS THAT WHILE HAVING OUTREACH AND DISCUSSION WITH THE ADJACENT PROPERTY OWNERS AND HAVING AN AGREEMENT, AT LEAST VERBALLY, TO WORK TOGETHER TO CONSTRUCT ANY KIND OF TRANSITIONAL SCREENING DOESN'T RELIEVE THE DEVELOPER OF THE IMPLICIT AND EXPLICIT RESPONSIBILITY TO CONSTRUCT A SCREENING.

SO AS YEARS GO BY, I DON'T WANT, THERE TO BE ANY MISUNDERSTANDING AS TO WHOSE RESPONSIBILITY IT IS TO MAINTAIN THAT FENCE, BECAUSE IF IT'S CONSTRUCTED DIRECTLY ON A PROPERTY LINE IT'S NOT THE RESIDENTIAL PROPERTY OWNER'S RESPONSIBILITY TO MAINTAIN THAT FENCE, EVEN IF THEY AGREE TO AN APPEARANCE OR A DESIGN, BECAUSE OUR CODE SIMPLY SAYS THAT THE MORE INTENSIVE USE AND THAT DEVELOPER IS REQUIRED TO CONSTRUCT THAT FENCE.

SECONDLY, IF THREE INDIVIDUALS ARE IN AGREEMENT WITH THE DEVELOPER THAT THEY DON'T MIND TAKING THEIR FENCE DOWN TO CONSTRUCT A FENCE, THEY ARE STILL REQUIRED TO CONSTRUCT ALONG THEIR PROPERTY LINE, AND THEY CAN'T EXCLUDE ANY OTHER PROPERTY OWNER THAT DOES NOT REPLY, IF THAT MAKES

[00:25:09]

DOES THAT MAKE SENSE TO EVERYONE? MEANING YOU CANNOT NOT CONSTRUCT THE FENCE BASED ON OUR CODE, IT HAS TO BE SOME TYPE OF EITHER VARIANCE REQUEST FOR LIVE SCREENING SOME OTHER TYPE OF FENCING TYPE THAT HAS TO BE CONSIDERED, BUT I DON'T WANT YOU TO THINK THAT THE DECISION OR RECOMMENDATION YOU MAKE TONIGHT RELIEVES ANYONE OF ANY RESPONSIBILITY TO CONSTRUCT SOMETHING.

I HESITATE TO ASK THIS QUESTION.

CAN WE APPROVE THE WOOD FENCE ON THE PROPERTY LINE PENDING APPROVAL FROM THE OTHER TWO? YOU CAN CONDITIONALLY APPROVE IT.

YES, BUT THE REALITY IS, WE HAVE NO IDEA WHETHER WE'RE GOING TO GET A RESPONSE FROM THOSE INDIVIDUALS, AND SO THIS IS SOMETHING THAT COULD SIT FOR MONTHS THE REALITY IS, LIKE I SAID, WE COULD HAVE APPROVED THIS ADMINISTRATIVELY ALREADY.

WE FELT THE NEED THAT WHAT WAS BEING PROPOSED WAS A DETERMINATION THAT SHOULD BE MADE BY THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION, BY CITY COUNCIL, BECAUSE IT COULD POTENTIALLY AFFECT THESE OWNERS OR THESE RESIDENTS, EVEN IF THEY WERE AWARE OF IT OR NOT, AND SO WHATEVER RECOMMENDATION YOU MAKE, OBVIOUSLY IT'S GOING TO GO TO CITY COUNCIL, BUT THAT'S NOT TO SAY THAT COUNCIL WILL OBVIOUSLY CONTINUE TO INCLUDE THAT CONDITION, AND WE MAY NEVER HEAR A RESPONSE FROM ANY OF THOSE INDIVIDUALS, AND STAFF DOES NEED TO HEAR AND RECEIVE SOME SORT OF FORMAL APPROVAL OF THIS PROPOSAL IN ORDER TO KIND OF DEEM THEIR SUPPORT AS LEGITIMATE.

WE HAVEN'T RECEIVED ANY OF THAT YET.

OKAY, THIS MAY BE REDUNDANT, BUT IF WE APPROVE A WOOD FENCE TONIGHT BASED ON IN WRITING SUBMISSION FROM THE THREE, WHAT HAPPENS TO THE OTHER TWO? WE DON'T HAVE IN WRITING SUBMISSION FROM THE THREE.

THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYING. WHAT HAPPENS TO THOSE TWO? DO YOU MIND IF I INTERJECT? GO AHEAD. SO IF THEY BUILD A FENCE ALONG THEIR PROPERTY LINE, NOT ABUTTING THE OTHER PROPERTY OWNERS, IT DOESN'T.

IT DOESN'T REALLY MATTER. YOU DON'T HAVE TO HAVE A IF I UNDERSTAND YOU CORRECTLY, YOU DON'T HAVE TO HAVE YOUR PROPERTY OWNER'S PERMISSION TO BUILD A FENCE ALONG YOUR PROPERTY LINE.

YOU CAN'T ENCROACH UPON THEIR PROPERTY, BUT YOU CAN ERECT A FENCE ON YOUR.

SO AS I UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'VE SAID IS, IS THE THREE HAVE AGREED TO LET YOU TEAR DOWN THEIR OLD FENCE AND PUT UP NEW FENCE.

THAT'S CORRECT. IN THE SITUATION, WHEN THEY GET TO THOSE OTHER TWO, THEY JUST THEIR FENCE WOULD LEAN UP AGAINST THE NEW FENCE, BUT ACCORDING TO THE GENTLEMAN EARLIER, AND I UNDERSTOOD WHAT HE WAS SAYING.

THERE STILL HAS TO BE SOMETHING BUILT PER THE ORDINANCE, CORRECT? ABSOLUTELY CORRECT. WHAT I'M SAYING IS TWO FENCES COULD BE BACK TO BACK WITH ONE ANOTHER.

NOT SAYING I'D ADVOCATE FOR THAT, I'M JUST SAYING THAT'S POSSIBLE.

WE ARE CERTAINLY OPEN TO THE CONDITIONAL APPROVAL OF US.

I WOULD RECOMMEND NOT DOING THE CONDITIONAL APPROVAL BASED ON WHAT TWO OTHER PROPERTY OWNERS MAY DO, BECAUSE IT'S REALLY HARD FOR US TO DESIGN DEFINE WHAT THEIR ASCENT WOULD LOOK LIKE, HOW IT WOULD COME.

WHAT I WOULD SAY [INAUDIBLE] HOLD YOU UP.

CORRECT I THINK AND AGAIN, I DON'T WANT TO PUT WORDS IN THE MOUTHS OF, YOU KNOW, YOU COMMISSIONERS, BUT WHAT I WOULD PREFER IF YOU WANTED TO [INAUDIBLE] THE WOOD FENCE, YOU KNOW, APPROVE THE WAIVER, FOR THE WOOD FENCE AND THEN IN YOUR REPORT, ASK THAT STAFF CONVEY TO COUNCIL THE DEEP DESIRE TO SEE ALL PROPERTY OWNERS AGREE TO THE TO THE WAIVER.

SOMETHING ALONG THOSE LINES.

I WOULD NOT MAKE IT CONDITIONAL ON THE OTHER TWO ACQUIESCING.

SO THAT WOULD KIND OF BE A RECOMMENDATION FROM US FOR COUNCIL TO DETERMINE FURTHER DOWN THE LINE.

NO, NO, WHAT I WOULD RECOMMEND IF YOU WANTED TO APPROVE THE WOOD FENCE AND JUST APPROVE THE WAIVER AS IS, JUST GO AHEAD AND APPROVE IT IN THE STAFF REPORT AS PART BECAUSE THIS IS ESSENTIALLY WE'RE MAKING A REPORT TO THE CITY COUNCIL STAFF CAN MAKE IT KNOWN, THAT IT WAS THE THIS BODY'S DESIRE THAT ALL PROPERTY OWNERS AGREE.

YOU STILL APPROVED IT WITH TWO OUTSTANDING BUT YOU WENT AHEAD AND APPROVED IT.

[00:30:01]

THAT WOULD SHOW UP UNDER THE DISCUSSION COMMENTS.

[INAUDIBLE]. YES, SIR.

AGAIN, LET ME ASK AGAIN TO JUST BE CLEAR.

CAN CAN APPLICANTS REQUEST A WAIVER OF THE FIVE FOOT OFFSET WITH THEIR.

CONCRETE FENCE.

IT'S NOT A WAFER, SO IT IS AN ENCROACHMENT AGREEMENT, AND SO WHAT WILL HAPPEN IS STAFF WILL REVIEW THE REQUEST FOR THE ENCROACHMENT BECAUSE THERE'S A FIVE FOOT UTILITY EASEMENT AND WE HAVE AN EXISTING SEWER.

WE HAVE ALREADY LOOKED AT IT, AND IF IT IS A SOLID MASONRY WALL WITH THE FOOTINGS, THE MAINTENANCE BECOMES THAT MUCH HARDER AND MORE EXPENSIVE ON THE CITY TO MAINTAIN THAT SEWER. SO WE WOULD NOT APPROVE THAT ENCROACHMENT INTO THE FIVE FOOT.

HOWEVER, A WOOD FENCE YOU CAN REMOVE SO THAT WOULD BE ALLOWED.

SO IT'S NOT A IT DOESN'T COME BEFORE US, IT GETS VETOED BEFORE WE HEAR ABOUT IT.

AS FAR AS TRYING TO OFFSET THAT FIVE FOOT.

SO THE OPTION IS A FIVE FOOT DEAD ZONE WITH WHAT I WOULD CONSIDER A PROPER FENCE OR A WOOD FENCE.

UNLESS THE APPLICANT WANTS TO APPEAL THAT DECISION TO CITY COUNCIL, IT WOULD NOT COME TO P&Z.

OKAY. THANK YOU, AND I'M ASSUMING THAT THE FIVE FOOT GAP YOU'D HAVE TO HAVE THAT WOULD BE THE BEGINNING OF THE STATEMENT FOOTER.

SO CEMENT FOOTER BEING TWO FOOT.

SO YOU'RE ACTUALLY TO CENTER THE FENCE WOULD BE MORE LIKE SIX OR 6.5FT BACK, AND THEN YOU'D HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT A PICKUP OR SOMEBODY WITH A TRUCK AND A TRAILER OR CAR AND SOMEBODY'S NOT PAYING ATTENTION, TAKING OUT THE FENCE AND DAMAGED AND STUFF LIKE THAT, AND THAT'S WHAT I LOOKED AT AFTER THE LAST MEETING.

I KNOW THIS AREA REAL WELL AND THAT'S WHY I WAS WORRIED ABOUT THAT FIVE FOOT BECAME A HAZARD TO VEHICLES AND DOING DAMAGE TO THE BUSINESSES INCOME AND POTENTIALLY TO THE HOMEOWNERS' PROPERTY BEHIND IT.

DO ANY OTHER COMMISSIONERS HAVE ANY COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS FOR FOR MR. [INAUDIBLE]? I GOT ONE.

ASIDE FROM THE FENCE, THE LIGHTING IS THE LIGHTS HOW HIGH IS THE FENCE GOING TO BE AND HOW MANY LIGHTS OR DO WE KNOW HOW MANY LIGHTS ARE APPROVED TO BE ON THE BUILDINGS? FROM THE RETAIL ESTABLISHMENTS? YEAH. NO, SIR, I DON'T.

OKAY I THINK THE FENCE, THE GUIDANCE ARE EIGHT FEET.

YEAH. OKAY, AND THE REASON I ASK WAS, IS IT POSSIBLE, AS WE GO THROUGH THE PROCESS OF PUTTING THE LIGHTS UP, DO POLE LIGHTS BACK TOWARDS YOUR BUILDING VERSUS TOWARDS THE RESIDENTIAL AREA? YES, SIR.

WE'D BE SENSITIVE TO THAT, ABSOLUTELY.

YEAH. OKAY.

YEAH, I THINK THEY CAN SPEAK. THE CITY CAN SPEAK ON THAT YOU'RE NOT ALLOWED TO EMIT LIGHT ONTO ADJOINING PROPERTY AND IT'S YEAH. I HEAR A SAYING THAT MICHELLE IF WE BUILD A MASONRY FENCE, IT'S GOING TO BE MORE DIFFICULT FOR THE CITY TO MAINTAIN THE SEWER LINE.

IF IT WAS WITHIN THE EASEMENT, IF IT WAS IN WITHIN THE EASEMENT.

SO THEY CAN STILL HAVE A MASONRY FENCE, AND WE WOULD WE WOULD LOOK AT LIKE IF WE LOOK AT IT, A DISAGREEMENT AT THIS TIME, WE'VE LOOKED AT IT AND OUR RESPONSE WAS THEY CAN BUILD THE MASONRY FENCE, BUT ON THE OUTSIDE OF THE [INAUDIBLE] EASEMENT, AND SO WHEN THEY SUBMITTED THE VARIANCE FOR THE WOOD FENCE, WE REVIEWED THAT.

KNOWING THAT, HE SAID, REMOVING THE PANELS AND BEING ABLE TO PUT THEM BACK THEN WE RE OKAY WITH THAT ENCROACHMENT WITHIN THAT EASEMENT BECAUSE AGAIN, THEY ARE REQUIRED TO PROVIDE THE SCREENING AND RESIDENTS THAT BOARD UP OR ARE WITHIN AN EASEMENT.

FENCES ARE ALLOWED, BUT WE DO ENTER INTO AN EASEMENT AGREEMENT.

OKAY. SO BUT IF THEY BUILT THE MASONRY FENCE WITH THE FIVE WITHIN THE FIVE FOOT, WOULD THE PROPERTY OWNERS THEN WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO BUILD A SEPARATION FENCE ALL THE WAY TO TO THEIR FENCE? NO, IT WOULDN'T BE THEIR PROPERTY.

SO THAT WOULD HAVE TO BE THEY WOULD HAVE TO STILL BE IN THE THING, AND SO YOU GOT FIVE FEET, WHICH NOBODY CAN, YOU KNOW, A BIG PERSON CAN'T EVEN WALK DOWN FIVE FEET AREA.

YOU KNOW, IT'S NOT VERY MUCH ROOM FOR ANYBODY TO BE IN THERE TO HAVE TO ACCESS A SEWER.

SO YOU HAVE SEWER LINE RUNNING FROM EACH PROPERTY OUT TO.

SO EACH OF THOSE PROPERTIES, THAT BUTT UP AGAINST THE COMMERCIAL PROPERTY, THEY DO CONNECT INTO THAT SEWER IN THE WELL, IN BETWEEN

[00:35:02]

OKAY, SO IF YOU HAD A SEWER PROBLEM THOUGH, PART OF IT'S THE HOMEOWNER'S RESPONSIBILITY, BUT IF IT'S PAST THEIR PROPERTY LINE, IT'S THE CITY, RIGHT? SO THE CITY WILL MAINTAIN THE SEWER WITHIN THE EASEMENT, AND THAT INCLUDES THE SERVICE TO THE EASEMENT LINE.

ANYTHING PAST THAT EASEMENT LINE IS THE RESPONSIBILITY OF, RIGHT, AND THAT'S THE WAY I MEAN, THAT'S THE WAY IT ALWAYS IS, BUT I JUST WONDERING HOW MUCH ISSUE HAVE YOU HAD WITH SEWER IN THAT AREA? I MEAN, IS THAT SEWER LINE, OH, BUT YOU ANTICIPATE PROBLEMS ON DOWN THE LINE, AND HONESTLY, I'M NOT SURE IF [INAUDIBLE] IT'S CONCRETE.

I KNOW...

YEAH, I'D HAVE TO GO BACK AND LOOK AT THAT, BUT IT IS AN OLDER SEWER AS I SAID, WE DID [INAUDIBLE] IT IT'S IN DECENT CONDITION, BUT IF THERE WAS ANYTHING THAT WAS WRONG OR WE DID HAVE TO GO IN THERE TO DO ANY MAINTENANCE, HAVING THE MASONRY WALL IN THE EASEMENT JUST PRESENTS A LOT MORE ISSUES TRYING TO DIG AND TAKE CARE OF ANYTHING.

OR IF WE NEEDED TO REPLACE IT, YOU COULDN'T PULL UP, AND NUMBER ONE, YOU PULLING UP THE FENCE WOULD BE A PROBLEM.

NUMBER TWO, PULLING A BACKHOE IN THERE WOULD BE ALMOST IMPOSSIBLE.

THAT WOULD BE HARD, AND THEN THE WAY THAT THE EASEMENT USE AGREEMENT READS IS THAT THE CITY, THE CITY CAN REMOVE OR REQUIRE THE PROPERTY OWNER TO REMOVE WHATEVER IS IN THE EASEMENT IN ORDER FOR US TO MAINTAIN, AND WE DO NOT HAVE TO PUT IT BACK [INAUDIBLE].

SO WOODEN FENCES ARE A LITTLE BIT EASIER TO WORK AROUND.

THAT'S WHY WHEN THEY SUBMITTED IT AND WE REVIEWED IT, WE'RE AGREEABLE TO THE WOOD FENCE.

THEY CAN STILL HAVE THE MASONRY.

WE WOULD JUST ASK THAT IT WOULD NOT BE WITHIN THE EASEMENT.

IF I MAY, DID YOU SAY THAT THE CITY, IF THEY HAD THE FIVE FOOT EASEMENT GAP, THE CITY MAINTAINED THAT FIVE FOOT GAP.

WE DON'T MAINTAIN THE FIVE FOOT GAP.

WE MAINTAIN THE SEWER LINE.

SO WITHIN THAT.

SO TO ASK WHO MAINTAINS THAT FIVE FOOT SORT OF GAP THERE? WHO'S GOING TO MOW IT? THE PROPERTY OWNER. OKAY, OKAY.

THE WOOD MATERIAL, IS IT GOING TO BE CEDAR SOMETHING THAT'S GOING TO LAST 30 YEARS OR SO OKAY.

YES, SIR. THE PROBLEM WITH THE SEWER, I WOULD HAVE TO ASK PUBLIC WORKS.

THEY DID NOT LET ME KNOW WHEN I ASKED THEM TO [INAUDIBLE] AND GET THE MEASURE DOWN, AND THEY DID NOT TELL ME THAT THEY WERE GOING TO [INAUDIBLE].

IT IS NOT [INAUDIBLE] A RENEWAL IT'S NOT ON THE LIST SO TO MY KNOWLEDGE, THERE'S NOT A CURRENT ISSUE [INAUDIBLE]. SO I KNOW WE TOUCHED ON THIS A LITTLE BIT EARLIER, AS FAR AS YOU KNOW, I'M TRYING TO THINK IN TERMS OF IF THAT WAS MY HOUSE BACK THERE I KNOW YOU HAD SAID THERE'S NOT MUCH DIFFERENCE IN NOISE REDUCTION BETWEEN THE MASONRY AND THE WOOD IS THERE WOULD THERE BE ANY MITIGATION IN THE NOISE LEVELS WITH, WITH A MASONRY OVER A WOODEN FENCE AT ALL, OR IS IT PRETTY COMPARABLE? I THINK IT'S HARD TO SAY WITHOUT DOING A STUDY, YOU KNOW, BUT I THINK ONE THING TO KEEP IN MIND IS THE LOCATION OF THIS PROPERTY.

IT'S RIGHT OFF OF 174.

IT'S A VERY BUSY STREET.

SO I MEAN, OBVIOUSLY AS YOU ADD A DRIVE-THRU, YOU DO HAVE ACTIVITY.

THERE IT IS. IT HAS BEEN A COMMERCIALLY ZONED PROPERTY FOR A VERY LONG TIME.

THERE USED TO BE A GAS STATION THERE AND SOME, YOU KNOW, SOME A SONIC THERE IN THE PAST.

SO BUT THEN WE ALSO HAVE THE VERY BUSY STREET.

SO IT'S REALLY HARD TO SAY WITHOUT DOING A STUDY, WHETHER THE PROPOSED DEVELOPMENT IS REALLY GOING TO ADD THAT MUCH MORE NOISE AND NUISANCE TO SOMETHING.

THAT MAY BE THE PROPERTY OWNERS ARE SOMEWHAT ALREADY USED TO OR OR WILL IT ADD TO THE 174 TRAFFIC NOISE THAT IS ONGOING CONSTANTLY? SO I DON'T HAVE A DEFINITIVE ANSWER FOR YOU, BUT IT'S A CHALLENGED LOCATION THAT DOESN'T CHANGE.

I CAN'T REMEMBER WHAT THE ALLOWED DECIBEL LEVEL IS.

I WANT TO SAY 81, BUT IT MAY BE 75 OR 76.

THAT'S TYPICAL 18 WHEELER TIRE NOISE PULLS THOSE NUMBERS PRETTY EASY, BUT IS THERE GOING TO BE ANY DIFFERENCE, REALLY, BETWEEN A MASONRY AND A WOODEN FENCE AS FAR AS MITIGATING NOISE? IN MY EXPERIENCE, IF YOU DO MASONRY, YOU'LL GET THE REVERB IT WILL BOUNCE OFF THE MASONRY, BACK OFF THE BUILDING, IT'LL GO HIGHER.

SO AS IT GOES BACK AND FORTH, IT'LL EVENTUALLY GO OVER.

THE WOOD WILL TEND TO ABSORB A LITTLE BIT MORE OF THE NOISE.

OKAY. DOES ANYBODY ELSE HAVE ANYTHING? NO. IN THAT CASE, I'LL GO AHEAD AND END THE PUBLIC HEARING AT 6:40.

[00:40:01]

I'LL TURN IT OVER TO THE COMMISSION TO MAKE ANY FURTHER COMMENTS.

OR IF THERE'S A MOTION THAT WE CAN FIGURE OUT BY ALL MEANS.

CAN I INTERJECT ONE LAST TIME? I'M SORRY. THERE'S LOTS OF CURVEBALLS TONIGHT IF THERE IS A MOTION TO APPROVE THE CASE, I WOULD ASK THAT YOU APPROVE IT AS A WAIVER AND A VARIANCE WAIVER, AND THE VARIANCE MIGHT SOUND WEIRD, BUT CHAPTER 36 OF THE CODE OF ORDINANCES, THERE'S A WAIVER SECTION AND THERE'S A VARIANCE SECTION, AND SOMETIMES EVEN THROUGHOUT THE CHAPTER, IT USES THOSE TERMS INTERCHANGEABLY, EVEN THOUGH THEY'RE NOT WITH ANOTHER SECTIONS OF THE CHAPTER.

SO AS IT'S PRESENTED, I DO BELIEVE IF THE WOOD FENCE WERE TO BE ALLOWED, THAT WOULD TECHNICALLY BE A WAIVER TO THE SCREENING REQUIREMENTS. I THINK THAT WOULD BE CORRECT.

SO JUST AN ABUNDANCE OF CAUTION, JUST WAIVER AND VARIANCE.

THANK YOU. MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE VARIANCE AND WAIVER AS REQUESTED WITH THE IDEA THAT THE STAFF PRESENT THE DISCUSSION AS REFLECTED HERE TONIGHT.

I'LL SECOND THE MOTION.

ALL RIGHT. MOTION BY DAVID.

SECOND BY COBI. ALL IN FAVOR, RAISE YOUR HAND.

ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU GUYS.

THANK YOU. ALL RIGHT MOVING ON TO REPORTS AND PRESENTATIONS.

[5.A.Consider approval of a minute order setting the Planning and Zoning Commission meeting dates for calendar year 2024. (Case 23-364) (Staff Contact: JP Ducay, Senior Planner)]

THANK YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN. MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION FOR THE RECORD, JP DUCAY, DEVELOPMENT SERVICES PRESENTING CASE 23-364.

THIS INVOLVES THE CONSIDERATION AND APPROVAL OF THE 2024 PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION MEETING DATE CALENDAR.

SO ESSENTIALLY, WHAT STAFF IS REQUESTING FROM THE COMMISSION TONIGHT IS TO REVIEW AND ULTIMATELY EITHER APPROVE THE 2024 CALENDAR AS PRESENTED OR WITH MODIFICATIONS.

SO THAT LARGE IMAGE ON THE SCREEN IS THE CURRENT PROPOSED 2024 CALENDAR.

ALL OF THE DATES THAT ARE HIGHLIGHTED IN YELLOW ARE THE ALREADY APPROVED CITY COUNCIL DATES.

SO THAT'S IMPORTANT BECAUSE THOSE DATES HAVE ALREADY BEEN APPROVED BY COUNCIL.

ALL OF THE DATES THAT ARE HIGHLIGHTED IN GREEN ARE WHAT WE'RE PROPOSING AND MAKING A DETERMINATION ON HERE TONIGHT.

THERE ARE A COUPLE OF MONTHS OF NOTE, SPECIFICALLY JULY.

YOU CAN SEE THAT THERE IS ONLY ONE MEETING DATE IN JULY, AND THAT'S A RESULT OF CITY COUNCIL'S APPROVED SCHEDULE ONLY HAVING ONE MEETING IN THAT MONTH, AND THEN IN SEPTEMBER, YOU CAN SEE THAT HAPPENS ONCE AGAIN.

WE'VE ONLY GOT ONE MEETING IN SEPTEMBER.

THAT'S MORE OF A RESULT OF KIND OF THE COMPOUNDING EFFECTS OF SOME OF THE PREVIOUS MONTHS.

YOU CAN SEE IN AUGUST WE HAVE A MEETING ON THE 27TH, AND SO WE WOULDN'T HAVE ONE ON THE THIRD OR OTHERWISE THEY'D BE BACK TO BACK WEEKS.

SO AGAIN, SEPTEMBER, THERE IS THE ONE MEETING AND THEN IN OCTOBER YOU CAN SEE WHERE THE FIRST AND THE THIRD, TUESDAY OF THAT MONTH, AND THERE WOULD BE A POSSIBILITY TO HAVE A MEETING ON THE 29TH, BUT THAT WOULD OBVIOUSLY BE CREATING A THREE MEETING MONTH, AND SO THOSE ARE SOME OF THE MONTHS OF NOTE, SOME OF THE PROS TO THIS CALENDAR, REALLY, DEPENDING ON HOW YOU LOOK AT IT, ARE THAT THIS DOES ELIMINATE ANY BACK TO BACK MEETING DAYS.

SO THERE'S NOT A SINGLE WEEK IN WHICH CITY COUNCIL AND THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION WILL HAVE MEETINGS ON BACK TO BACK DAYS, AND THEN AGAIN, DEPENDING ON HOW YOU'RE LOOKING AT LOOKING AT IT, SOME OF THE CONS ARE THAT THIS DOES INTERRUPT THE SECOND AND FOURTH TUESDAY OF EVERY MONTH.

I KNOW IN YEARS PAST, THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION AT LEAST ATTEMPTED TO MEET ON THE SECOND AND FOURTH TUESDAY OF EVERY MONTH WHEN POSSIBLE.

OBVIOUSLY, THAT DOESN'T EXIST ON THIS CALENDAR, AND IT DOES, AS I MENTIONED, CREATE THREE ONE MEETING MONTHS, AND THAT WAS, OF COURSE, THE JULY, SEPTEMBER AND DECEMBER MEETINGS, TWO OF THEM BEING A RESULT OF CITY COUNCIL ONLY HAVING ONE MEETING THAT MONTH AS WELL.

SO STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF THE CALENDAR AS PRESENTED OR AS MODIFIED BY THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION FOR THE 2024 MEETING CALENDAR.

IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR STAFF, WE'LL TRY OUR BEST TO ANSWER THEM FOR YOU.

ALL RIGHT. THANKS, JP. PERSONALLY, I DON'T HAVE ANY ISSUES WITH THESE DATES.

I KNOW IT'S, YOU KNOW, PRETTY IN LINE WITH WHAT WE'VE DONE WE KNOW WHEN SPRING BREAK IS.

BELIEVE IT'S THE 11TH.

IT IS THE FIRST WEEKEND IN MARCH FOR MY FAMILY.

[00:45:04]

NO NO NO NO, IT'S THE 13TH, ACTUALLY, THE 13TH.

GOOD GRIEF. I THINK IT'S THE 11TH.

THAT WEEK OF THE 11TH IN MARCH.

I WILL MISS THAT DAY.

YEAH, I THINK IN THE PAST WE'VE NOT HAD A MEETING THAT WEEK.

IS THAT CORRECT? I BELIEVE LAST YEAR THERE WERE MODIFICATIONS MADE SPECIFICALLY FOR THAT BREAK.

YES. OKAY.

SO ASIDE FROM SPRING BREAKS, ANYBODY ELSE SEE ANY CONFLICTS? YOU'RE MEETING THE SAME WEEK AS THANKSGIVING.

I DON'T KNOW WHETHER THAT'S AN ISSUE FOR ANYBODY OR NOT.

I GUARANTEE I WON'T MISS A MEAL.

[CHUCKLING] MR. CHAIRMAN, JUST TO CONFIRM, SPRING BREAK IS THE 11TH THROUGH THE 15TH OF MARCH.

OKAY. SO I WOULD ASSUME, AND MYSELF AS WELL THAT WE PROBABLY WOULD NOT WORK.

THERE WOULD BE QUITE A FEW OF US MISSING, AND THEN THAT'S A GOOD POINT. DAVID BROUGHT UP ABOUT THE THANKSGIVING WEEK AS WELL.

I MEAN, TYPICALLY WE ONLY HAVE ONE MEETING IN NOVEMBER, CORRECT? THIS YEAR WE ONLY HAD ONE.

AS WELL AS CITY COUNCIL.

THEY'VE OBVIOUSLY UPDATED THE CALENDAR THIS YEAR FOR TWO BECAUSE WE IT HAS BECOME A CONCERN IN THE PAST OF ONLY HAVING ONE MEETING IN NOVEMBER AND DECEMBER, WHERE WE HAVE A LOT OF KIND OF CASES STARTING TO PILE UP AND ESSENTIALLY GETTING DELAYED BECAUSE OF THE LACK OF MEETING AVAILABILITY.

RIGHT. YOU COULD MOVE THE MEETING ON THE 26TH TO THE THIRD TO DECEMBER, AND STILL MAINTAIN THE NON-DUPLICATE WITH THE COUNCIL.

YEAH, WITH THAT ONLY BEING A WEEK LATER.

I AGREE THAT WOULD BE A GOOD ALTERNATIVE, BUT I'M OPEN TO WHATEVER YOU GUYS DECIDE.

I'M REAL FLEXIBLE.

ALL RIGHT. SO THE MARCH 12TH WOULD NOT WORK, AND THEN I'M COMPLETELY OPEN PERSONALLY TO MOVING THE NOVEMBER 26TH MEETING TO DECEMBER 3RD.

I DON'T KNOW IF ANYBODY ELSE SEES ANY CONFLICTS.

CAN WE MAKE A MOTION TO JUST CHANGE THOSE? ABSOLUTELY, AND THEN ACCEPT THE REST.

YEAH YOU CAN RECOMMEND OR YOU CAN APPROVE WITH THOSE MODIFICATIONS AND THAT WOULD ONLY GIVE US ONE IN MARCH.

THAT'S CORRECT. YEAH.

IF WE REMOVE THAT MARCH 12TH MEETING THAT WOULD BE ONE MEETING IN MARCH.

IS THAT GOING TO CAUSE A WOULD THAT BE AN ISSUE? NOT NECESSARILY, USUALLY JANUARY, FEBRUARY AND APRIL ARE ALL PRETTY IN-TUNE.

SO IF THERE IS MAYBE ONE DAY IN WHICH ONE MEETING THAT WE DO MISS, I THINK IT SHOULDN'T CAUSE TOO MANY, YOU KNOW, RIPPLING EFFECTS THAT WOULD BE NEGATIVE.

ALL RIGHT. LAST CHANCE.

NOTHING ELSE. ALL RIGHT.

I'LL ENTERTAIN A MOTION TO.

I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE WITH THE CHANGES IN THE IN THE DATES, AS WE'VE STATED OUT LOUD FOR NOVEMBER AND MARCH. I'LL SECOND.

A MOTION BY MICHAEL AND A SECOND BY DAN.

ALL IN FAVOR, RAISE YOUR HANDS.

PASSES UNANIMOUSLY.

ALL RIGHT. ITEM 5B, ANOTHER REPORT AND PRESENTATION.

[5.B.Lumberyard at 137 S. Wilson Street (Case 23-289): Consider approval of a resolution for a waiver to Article III, Landscape Standards, relating to artificial turf. (Staff Presenter: JP Ducay, Senior Planner) ]

CONSIDER APPROVAL OF A RESOLUTION FOR WAIVER TO ARTICLE THREE LANDSCAPE STANDARDS RELATING TO ARTIFICIAL TURF.

STAFF PRESENTER JP DUCAY.

THANK YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN.

MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION FOR THE RECORD, JP DUCAY DEVELOPMENT SERVICES PRESENTING CASE 23-289.

THIS IS A LANDSCAPE WAIVER AND THE APPLICANT IS DERRICK [INAUDIBLE].

THE SUBJECT PROPERTY IS APPROXIMATELY 0.30 ACRES AND IS ADDRESSED AS 137 SOUTH WILSON STREET.

SO A LITTLE BIT OF THE BACKGROUND, THE OWNER OF THE SUBJECT PROPERTY IS PROPOSING TO REDEVELOP THE MOONTOWER PIZZA SITE, AND THEY'RE REDEVELOPING IT FOR A FUTURE RESTAURANT

[00:50:04]

THE APPLICANT'S JUSTIFICATION FOR THIS REQUEST IS THAT THE EXISTING CRUSHED GRANITE CURRENTLY TRACKS A LOT OF DIRT, AND IT'S AN ONGOING MAINTENANCE ISSUE, AND THAT THE OWNER WISHES TO EVENTUALLY KIND OF REPLICATE THAT OUTDOOR ENTERTAINMENT FEEL AND ESTHETIC THAT WE CURRENTLY HAVE OUTSIDE OF HERE IN THE PLAZA.

THIS IMAGE IS WHAT YOU CAN SEE ARE THE CURRENT CONDITIONS OF THE SUBJECT SITE, AND THAT CRUSHED GRANITE SURFACE.

IT IS STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION OF APPROVAL OF A RESOLUTION FOR THIS LANDSCAPE WAIVER, SPECIFICALLY FOR THAT 0.10 ACRE PORTION OF 137 SOUTH WILSON STREET, AS PROPOSED BY THE APPLICANT, AND SOME OF THE CONDITIONS THAT LED TO THE SUPPORT ARE THAT THE APPLICANT PROVIDED A DRAINAGE ANALYSIS, AND THAT ANALYSIS DID DETERMINE THAT THE ADDITIONAL RUNOFF GENERATED BY THE SYNTHETIC TURF WOULD NOT CAUSE ANY ADVERSE EFFECTS OFF SITE OR DOWNSTREAM.

MYSELF AND THE APPLICANT ARE AVAILABLE.

WE HAVE ARTIFICIAL TURF OUT THERE, RIGHT? YES, SIR. THAT'S AWESOME.

YEAH. I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE.

YEAH. I'LL SECOND.

ALL RIGHT.

WHO SECONDED THAT? DAVID. ALL RIGHT, I HAVE A MOTION BY MICHAEL, SECOND BY DAVID.

ALL IN FAVOR, RAISE YOUR HANDS.

PASSES UNANIMOUSLY.

THANK YOU. [INAUDIBLE] I THINK THAT WAS AN EASY ONE.

ALL RIGHT, ONE LAST REPORT FIVE C, RECEIVE A REPORT REGARDING AN UPDATE TO THE CITY'S ZONING ORDINANCE.

[5.C.Receive a report regarding an update to the city’s zoning ordinance. (Staff Presenter: Lidon Pearce, Senior Planner)]

ALL RIGHT GOOD EVENING.

LIDON PEARCE SENIOR PLANNER.

SO THIS IS A BRIEF OF THE ZONING CODE UPDATE EFFORTS BY STAFF.

THIS MAY LOOK SOMEWHAT FAMILIAR IF YOU WATCHED THE NOVEMBER 13TH, I BELIEVE, CITY COUNCIL MEETING THIS IS THE SAME BRIEF THAT WAS PROVIDED TO THEM WITH 1 OR 2 SMALL CHANGES SO THIS IS JUST KIND OF A BASIC, YOU KNOW, THE PURPOSE OF ZONING.

SO JUST MOST OF YOU ARE WELL AWARE OF THIS, BUT IT'S JUST TO FURTHER THE GOALS OF OUR COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, AND AS THE TEXAS LOCAL GOVERNMENT CODE SAYS, TO PROMOTE PUBLIC HEALTH, SAFETY, MORALE AND GENERAL WELFARE OF THE CITY, AND IT'S TO PROTECT AND PRESERVE PLACES OF AREAS OF HISTORICAL, CULTURAL OR ARCHITECTURAL IMPORTANCE AND SIGNIFICANCE AS I GO THROUGH THESE SLIDES PLEASE STOP ME IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS TO OPEN DISCUSSION.

IF YOU HAVE ANY FEEDBACK OR A QUESTION ABOUT SOMETHING, I WILL DO MY BEST TO ANSWER, AND THAT WAY WE DON'T HAVE TO.

THERE'S LIKE 30 SLIDES. SO I DON'T WANT YOU GUYS TO HAVE TO TRY TO REMEMBER A QUESTION FOR 20 MINUTES.

JUST STOP ME.

SO THIS IS JUST A REFRESHER WHAT CONSTITUTES A ZONING CHANGE, AS YOU SEE THERE ON YOUR SCREEN? IF IT'S INCONSISTENT WITH THE LANDOWNERS' DESIRE, THEY'LL PETITION OR APPLY TO THE PLANNING AND ZONING, AND CITY COUNCIL FOR A CHANGE OF ZONING OR CITY COUNCIL CAN AMEND OR CHANGE BY ORDINANCE THE BOUNDARIES OF DISTRICTS ESTABLISHED BY OUR ZONING ORDINANCES AFTER PROPER PUBLICATION POSTED A NOTICE RECEIPT OF FINDINGS AND RECOMMENDATION FROM THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION.

THOSE CAN BE MEETINGS CAN BE DONE JOINTLY AND AFTER A PUBLIC HEARING AT CITY COUNCIL AND UPON QUALIFYING VOTE BY COUNCIL TO AMEND THE DISTRICT OR BOUNDARY ANY AMENDMENTS TO THE ZONING ORDINANCE CONSTITUTE A CHANGE.

SO THIS IS JUST KIND OF A NON-CONFORMING USE.

SO THIS WILL KIND OF WE'LL TOUCH ON THIS IN SOME LATER SLIDES, BUT ESSENTIALLY IT'S THE USE IS PERMITTED OF A PROPERTY EXCUSE ME WHICH WOULD OTHERWISE MEAN A VIOLATION OF THE CURRENT ZONING.

SO TO SIMPLIFY IT, IF THE USE EXISTED IN THE ZONING CHANGES AND THAT USE IS NO LONGER ALLOWED, WE DON'T GO IN AND JUST SAY THEY'RE LEGAL, NON-CONFORMING IS GENERALLY YOU'LL HEAR THAT TERM.

SOMETIMES YOU'LL HEAR GRANDFATHERED.

THEY'RE GRANDFATHERED IN.

SO EFFECTIVELY IF SOMEBODY'S ZONING CHANGES IN THAT USE IS NO LONGER ALLOWED, THEY'RE ALLOWED TO CONTINUE UNTIL THEY ARE.

SOME THINGS IN THE CODE WOULD THAT WOULD LAPSE AND THEY NO LONGER ALLOWED TO BE NONCONFORMING AND THEY CANNOT BE ENLARGED, CHANGED OR ALTERED.

[00:55:06]

THEY HAD SOME FEEDBACK AFTER THEY READ THE DRAFT.

IT WAS JUST PRIMARILY FOCUSED ON ADDING GRAPHICS AND TABLES TO THE CODE.

SO IT'S MORE VISUAL, AND THEN SOME CHANGES TO THE OTHER SECTIONS OF CODE AS FAR AS LANDSCAPING AND PARKING AND SO ON SO THIS IS NOW KIND OF THE HIGHLIGHT.

SO AGAIN, FEEL FREE TO STOP ME IF YOU HAVE A QUESTION OR IF YOU WOULD LIKE ME TO CLARIFY ANYTHING SO WE'VE THE BIGGEST THING IS WE'VE GONE FROM IF YOU'RE FAMILIAR WITH OUR CURRENT CODE, WE HAVE THESE LISTS OF VERY SPECIFIC USES, AND IF WHAT YOU'RE TRYING TO DO AS A DEVELOPER OR LANDOWNER ISN'T IMPLICITLY LISTED THERE, IT CAN CREATE SOME CONFUSION.

SO WE'VE GONE TO BROAD LAND USE CATEGORIES WHERE WE DEFINE WHAT WE EXPECT TO SEE IN THAT AREA.

SO AS I SAID, JUST LOOKING AT THE CODE AND SEE AN ANTIQUE SHOP, YOU'D SEE SOMETHING LIKE RETAIL, AND THEN IT KIND OF DESCRIBES WHAT IS EXPECTED OF RETAIL.

SO THAT ALLOWS FUTURE USES THAT WE MAY NOT KNOW EXIST NEW TECHNOLOGIES OR SOME USE WITHOUT HAVING TO COME BACK AND GET CLARIFICATION OR KEEP AMENDING THE CODE. SO IT ALLOWS BROADER CLARIFICATION FOR STAFF AND DEVELOPERS AND LANDOWNERS TO KNOW WHAT THEY CAN DO WITH THEIR PROPERTY.

WE HAVE UPDATED SOME OF OUR LANGUAGE AND DEFINITIONS.

THERE'S JUST SOME STUFF IN THE CODE THAT'S NO LONGER RELEVANT WE ARE LOOKING AT WE'VE PROPOSED CONVERTING THE I-35 AND BUSINESS PARK OVERLAYS INTO THEIR OWN ZONING DISTRICTS. SO THIS ALLOWS ONE P AND Z AND COUNCIL MORE DISTRICTS TO CHOOSE FROM WHEN SOMEONE COMES IN TO REQUEST A ZONING AS OPPOSED TO WE HAVE COMMERCIAL INDUSTRIAL NOW YOU'LL HAVE MORE SPECIFIC YOU'LL HAVE AN INTERSTATE COMMERCIAL ZONING DISTRICT AND A BUSINESS PARK ZONING DISTRICT.

THAT ALSO MAKES IT EASIER FOR DEVELOPERS AND LANDOWNERS BECAUSE THEY DON'T HAVE TO GO TO DIFFERENT SECTIONS OF OUR ORDINANCES.

NOW, ALL THOSE STANDARDS ARE INCORPORATED INTO THE ZONING DISTRICT, AS OPPOSED TO I HAVE TO LOOK HERE AT THIS ZONING DISTRICT, I HAVE TO GO LOOK AT THIS OVERLAY DISTRICT, AND THEN I HAVE TO LOOK AT THESE OVERLAY DESIGN STANDARDS.

SO ALL BE IN ONE AREA, MUCH MORE USER FRIENDLY CODE WE ARE LOOKING AT THE SINGLE FAMILY LOT SIZE.

GOING FROM 7000 IS OUR MINIMUM TO 8500FT² SO THAT WOULD BE A NEW SF-8.5 ZONING DISTRICT.

SO WHAT THAT MEANS IS ANYBODY THAT'S PLATTED OR HAS SF SEVEN, IT'S NOT GOING TO IMPACT THEM, BUT NEW LAND USE REQUESTS FOR SUBDIVISIONS, THE MINIMUM ON THE BOOKS WILL BE 8.5.

IF THEY WANT TO DO ANYTHING THAT WAS MORE DENSE, THEY'D HAVE TO PROPOSE A PLAN DEVELOPMENT AND WE DID ALTER THE PLAN DEVELOPMENT LANGUAGE TO MAKE IT MORE CLEAR WHAT WE EXPECT WHEN WE GET A PLAN DEVELOPMENT.

IT'S NOT JUST TO GET MORE DENSITY.

THERE'S OTHER THINGS WE'RE LOOKING AT WHEN THEY PROPOSE THOSE.

SO THIS POINT I KIND OF GO THROUGH A COUPLE OF THE ZONING DISTRICTS.

YOU CAN KIND OF SEE THESE USE CATEGORIES HERE.

SO FOR COMMERCIAL WE'VE GOT ABOUT 582 PARCELS THAT ARE ZONED CURRENTLY.

SOME OF THE BIG CHANGES ARE FROM BY-RIGHT TO REQUIRING AN SUP.

SO WHAT THAT MEANS IS THOSE USES, YOU SEE THERE, AUTO REPAIR AND PAINT, HOSPITAL, COMMERCIAL TRUCK PARKING AND DAYCARE CURRENTLY IN COMMERCIAL THEY CAN DO THOSE BY RIGHT. THEY'D HAVE TO DO AN SUP NOW SO WE KIND OF MOVE THOSE USES PROPOSED TO MORE APPROPRIATE DISTRICTS, AND THEN IF THEY SOMEONE WANTED TO DO THAT, SAY ON WILTSHIRE MOVING FORWARD, THEY'D HAVE TO GET AN SUP.

SO IT GIVES US A LITTLE MORE FLEXIBILITY IN EVALUATING THAT ON A CASE BY CASE.

SO WHEN YOU SAY MOVING FORWARD, THESE ARE FOR NEW BUSINESSES.

IF THERE'S AN OLD BUSINESS CURRENTLY EXISTING, THEY'RE GRANDFATHERING FROM THIS AND THEY WOULDN'T HAVE TO SORT OF CLOSE THEIR BUSINESS.

THAT IS CORRECT. WE'RE NOT SHUTTERING ANYBODY.

NOW, WHAT I WOULD SAY IS IF LET'S SAY THEY HAVE TWO ACRES AND THEY HAVE AN AUTO REPAIR AND IT'S IN A SPOT AND THEY ARE COMMERCIAL CURRENTLY AND THIS GETS ADOPTED, THEY WOULD BE ABLE TO NON-CONFORMING, THEY WOULD BE ABLE TO CONTINUE USE BUT IF THEY PURCHASED TWO ACRES NEXT TO THEM AND WANTED TO EXPAND NOW THEY HAVE GOT TO COME GET A SPECIFIC USE PERMIT BEFORE THEY EXPAND THAT NON-CONFORMING USE, AND THAT WOULD BE THE METHOD BY WHICH P&Z AND COUNCIL COULD APPROVE THAT AND THEN A COUPLE OF THINGS THAT GO THAT ARE CURRENTLY A SPECIFIC USE PERMIT, INDOOR AMUSEMENT AND MINI GOLF, THOSE WOULD BE ALLOWED BY RIGHT NOW.

SO CURRENTLY IF YOU WANT TO DO ANY KIND OF INDOOR AMUSEMENT AND COMMERCIAL, YOU GOT TO COME BEFORE YOU GUYS THIS WOULD ALLOW THOSE TO DO THOSE BY.

[01:00:03]

SO KIND OF THE CHANGES FROM THAT.

SO RIGHT NOW YOU GO FROM AUTO FUEL SALES AND GENERAL RETAIL WILL GO FROM BUY RIGHT TO AN SUP AS WELL AS HOSPITALS, MEDICAL CENTERS AND COMMERCIAL TRUCK PARKING.

SO GENERAL RETAIL IS KIND OF MORE WHAT YOU EXPECT GENERAL RETAIL AND SOME OF THE USES THAT WE CURRENTLY HAVE, YOU ANTICIPATE MORE IN A COMMERCIAL OR INDUSTRIAL SETTING.

SO WE'RE MAKING THOSE AN SUP NOW AND THEN ALLOWING INDOOR AMUSEMENT, MINI GOLF.

YOU KIND OF SEE A TREND. A LOT OF THESE USES ARE VERY SIMILAR.

WE'RE JUST KIND OF TRYING TO CLEAN THOSE UP.

SO WE GET THE DEVELOPMENT THAT IS MOST APPROPRIATE IN THOSE LOCATIONS BEFORE YOU MOVE OFF OF THAT.

SO A DAYCARE COULD PUT UP OR ISSUE WITH AN SUP FOR A RADIO FREQUENCY TRANSMISSION OR A CELL TOWER.

SO YOU'RE KIND OF GETTING INTO PRIMARY AND ACCESSORY USES THERE.

SO A PRIMARY USE RIGHT NOW AND THAT'S NOT CHANGING WITH THIS PROPOSAL, BUT A PRIMARY USE OF DAYCARE ALLOWED BY RIGHT.

IF SOMEBODY WANTED TO PUT UP A YOU SAID A RADIO TOWER.

SO THERE'S A WHOLE SECTION OF THE CODE JUST FOR THOSE.

SO THAT'S, THAT'S I WON'T SAY A BAD EXAMPLE, BUT IT GETS A LITTLE HAIRY, BUT THEY WOULD HAVE TO COME BEFORE YOU TO GET AN SUP.

IN ADDITION TO MEETING ALL THE RADIO TOWER ANTENNA REQUIREMENTS THAT WE ALSO HAVE IN THE CODE, BUT LET'S SAY IT WAS A DAYCARE AND THEY WERE GOING TO DO A QUICK VEHICLE SERVICING CAR WASH.

THEY'D HAVE TO GET AN SUP.

DID THAT ANSWER YOUR QUESTION CORRECTLY? I DON'T WANT TO--YEAH.

IT JUST MEANS THE WAY I'M READING THIS, YOU CAN PUT A CELL TOWER UP IN ANY OF THESE GENERAL RETAILER, GENERAL RETAIL AREAS.

YEAH. THAT'S SO YEAH, YOU MAY BE THINKING READING TOO MUCH INTO THAT.

THAT'S NOT THE INTENT THERE.

SO THE INTENT CURRENTLY IS ANYTIME YOU DO A CELL TOWER, WE HAVE A WHOLE SECTION OF THE CODE WHERE THEY HAVE TO FOLLOW BY THAT.

SO IF SOMEBODY HAD A PROPERTY AS A PRIMARY USE, THEY DON'T THINK OF AND SUP AS ACCESSORY USE NEGATIVE AS ITS OWN THING.

IF THEIR PRIMARY USE WAS GOING TO BE RADIO TOWER, THEY NEED TO GET AN SUP.

SO EVERY PROPERTY HAS TO BE HAVE USES THAT ARE ALLOWED BY RIGHT.

YOU'RE KIND OF TALKING ABOUT PUTTING AN ACCESSORY USE WITH A PRIMARY USE, AND WE HAVE PROVISIONS IN THE CODE FOR THAT AS WELL.

WELL, AND I WILL INTERJECT JUST REGARDING RADIO TOWERS AND CELL TOWERS, THE AMOUNT OF FEDERAL LAW THAT GOVERNS WHERE THEY GO IS A TON, AND IT SUPERSEDES OUR ZONING ORDINANCE, AND QUITE A FEW WAYS.

THERE ARE TIMES WHERE WE FEDERAL LAW TELLS US WHERE THEY'RE GOING TO GO MORE AND WE HAVE CONTROL OF VERY CERTAIN THINGS, BUT FEW THINGS AND SO I WOULD SAY, DESPITE EVEN WHAT OUR CODE SAYS, IT'S A RAPIDLY, VERY RAPIDLY CHANGING AREA OF LAW, EVER EVOLVING AREA OF LAW, BUT FEDERAL LAW, THE FCC CONTROLS THAT.

FEDERAL GOVERNMENT DICTATES A LOT OF WHERE THOSE THINGS ARE PLACED AND HOW THEY CAN BE PLACED.

SO JUST TO MAKE SURE, I'M UNDERSTANDING ALSBURY AND SUMMER CREST.

IT'S A GENERAL RETAIL AREA.

THERE'S PARCEL ZONE, GENERAL RETAIL.

YEAH. SO THEY COULD PUT UP A CELL TOWER IF THEY GET A SPECIFIC USE PERMIT.

IF THEY GET IT APPROVED, IF THEY GET IT APPROVED, THEY MEET ALL THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE SUP AS WELL AS WELL AS ALL THE REQUIREMENTS BUT THAT'S YOUR DISCRETION.

SO WE HAVE A WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT THE FUNNEL OF HOW ZONING WORKS, A PERMIT HAS TO MEET THE LETTER OF THE LAW AND ZONING.

YOU HAVE BROAD DISCRETION.

SO THAT'S WHY IT'S AN SUP AND NOT BY RIGHT, BECAUSE YOU CAN SAY WE DON'T THINK THAT FITS ON ALSBURY AND SUMMER CREST.

SO WE'RE DENYING THAT REQUEST.

YOU DON'T HAVE TO APPROVE IT.

IF IT'S AN SUP, YOU JUST THEY HAVE TO HAVE A METHOD BY WHICH TO ASK.

SO IS THERE A HARM IN REMOVING IT? IS THERE HARM IN REMOVING? NOT NECESSARILY FOR THAT SPECIFIC USE.

LIKE THE CITY ATTORNEY MENTIONED, THERE'S OUR HANDS ARE VERY TIED.

SO IF YOU'VE BEEN HERE WHEN WE'VE HAD A CELL TOWER COME THROUGH, I THINK LAST WAS ABOUT TWO YEARS AGO.

THEY WILL SEND LAWYERS.

THEY WILL SEND TWO HOURS WORTH OF MATERIAL.

IT'S NOT AS EASY AS IT'S A LITTLE MORE COMPLICATED.

TOP MY HEAD. I DON'T KNOW IF YOU CAN REMOVE IT, TO BE HONEST.

THAT'S SOMETHING WE COULD LOOK INTO.

MY GUT PROBABLY SAYS NO.

THE LAST TIME WE HAD A CELL TOWER COME BEFORE THIS BODY IN THE CITY COUNCIL, WE PRETTY MUCH HAD TO TELL THEM.

DESPITE WHAT YOUR ORDINANCE SAYS, FEDERAL LAW SAYS THEY GET IT HERE.

IT'S JUST A MATTER OF HEIGHT THAT YOU WANT TO GRANT I THINK I THINK THAT ONE, THE LAST ONE THROUGH CITY COUNCIL, I REMEMBER I THINK YOU ALL RESTRICTED THEM TO 100FT, AND I THINK THEY WANT TO GO 150.

WELL, EVEN THEN THEY GET 50 ADDITIONAL FEET.

I CAN'T REMEMBER IF IT'S 50 OR 20 ON TOP OF WHAT YOU GRANT, WHICH AGAIN, IS MORE FEDERAL LAW WEIRDNESS BUT WE CAN LOOK AT THAT, BUT AGAIN,

[01:05:11]

I CANNOT PROMISE YOU.

WE COULD JUST COMPLETELY REMOVE IT.

THAT'S SOMETHING WE CAN LOOK INTO, AND AGAIN, IT'S AN SUP FOR A REASON.

NOT BY RIGHT. SO YOU STILL HAVE TO COME BEFORE YOU SO.

WELL, BUT THE ISSUE IS IF IT'S THERE IN BLACK AND WHITE, THEN WE'VE GOT TO HAVE A REASON FOR DENYING IT.

IF IT'S OUT OF THERE AND IT'S NOT AN SUP BILL, IF IT DOESN'T MEET ALL THE QUALIFICATIONS, THEN YOU DON'T HAVE THE ISSUE THAT YOU HAVE TO FIGHT. I THINK YOU'RE MAYBE A LITTLE BIT OF GRAY AREA AND SUBDIVISION REGULATIONS AND PERMITS VERSUS ZONING.

SO YOU HAVE BROAD DISCRETION OF ZONING IF YOU DETERMINE THAT IT DOESN'T MEET THOSE, THINGS THAT I TALKED ABOUT AT THE BEGINNING LET'S PULL IT UP.

IF IT DOESN'T PROMOTE THE PUBLIC HEALTH, SAFETY, MORALE FOR THE CITY, YOU DON'T HAVE TO APPROVE IT.

SO YOU HAVE BROAD DISCRETION WHEN IT COMES TO ZONING.

SO IT'S NOT THE SAME AS A PERMIT, AND YOU'RE GOING TO FIND RADIO TRANSMISSION IS SUP ON A LOT OF THESE.

SO FOR THE REASON THAT THE CITY ATTORNEY KIND OF MENTIONED ALLUDED TO NEIGHBORHOOD SERVICES.

SO THIS IS FROM FRYE RIGHT TO AN SUP WOULD BE SELF-SERVICE STORAGE.

SO YOUR MINI WAREHOUSES.

SO RIGHT NOW THEREBY RIGHT IN OUR NEIGHBORHOOD SERVICES, BUT THIS ESSENTIALLY BECOMES GENERAL RETAIL.

WE ONLY HAVE 12 PARCELS. SO WHAT WE'RE DOING IS GOING TO REMOVE THIS FROM THE BOOKS, ESSENTIALLY, AND ANY NEW REQUEST, IF SOMEONE WANTED NEIGHBORHOOD SERVICES WOULD COME FORWARD AS A GENERAL RETAIL ZONING AND THE ONES THAT ARE CURRENTLY NEIGHBORHOOD SERVICES WILL STILL BE ALLOWED TO HAVE ALL THESE USES.

IT'S NOT GOING TO THIS IS ONE OF THOSE WHERE IT WAS ENACTED, BUT NOT A LOT OF PARCELS ACTUALLY EVER BECAME THAT ZONING DISTRICT, AND THEN IT ALLOWS SOME THINGS THAT ARE SHOULD HAVE BEEN PROBABLY BY RIGHT TO BEGIN WITH OFFICE, TRADITIONAL RETAIL SALES AND SERVICES.

SO CENTRAL COMMERCIAL.

SO THIS IS GENERALLY YOUR OLD TOWN AREA.

SO WE WOULD HAVE FROM BY RIGHT, TO ACQUIRE AN SUP FOR A COLLEGE CAMPUS AND A PUBLIC FACILITY, MUNICIPAL BUILDINGS, A LOT OF THAT'S BECAUSE OF THE PARKING REQUIREMENT IN OLD TOWN AND CENTRAL COMMERCIAL.

THERE IS NO PARKING REQUIREMENT.

SO WE WANT THOSE TO BE AN SUP.

SO WE CAN KIND OF MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE NOT PUTTING A COLLEGE CAMPUS IN OLD TOWN WITH NO PARKING AND CREATING SOME KIND OF NIGHTMARE FOR THE BUSINESSES AROUND HERE.

WE ALSO HAVE A FROM SUP TO ALLOW BY RIGHT WOULD BE INDOOR AMUSEMENT, WHICH KIND OF LIKE YOU SEE SOME OF THE FACILITIES WE ALREADY HAVE IN OLD TOWN.

SO INDUSTRIAL THIS IS ONE OF THE ONES THAT HAS SOME SIGNIFICANT CHANGES.

SO FROM BY RIGHT TO REQUIRE AN SUP WOULD BE SEXUALLY ORIENTED BUSINESSES.

SO I WOULD SAY WE DO HAVE OTHER STANDARDS FOR SOBS THAT MAKE THEM THAT THEY HAVE TO FOLLOW BEFORE THEY CAN DO THAT, BUT THEY CURRENTLY ARE BY RIGHT AND INDUSTRIAL, WHICH IS WHY YOU SEE A LOT OF PDS FOR INDUSTRIAL USES.

THIS WOULD MAKE THEM SUP, SO IT WOULD OPEN BACK UP TO INDUSTRIAL USING AS A BASE ZONING THAT, YOU KNOW, WOULD MAKE IT MORE COMFORTABLE FOR US TO USE, AND WE GO WE ALLOW MANUFACTURING AND PRODUCTION USES BY RIGHT, WHICH WE'RE CURRENTLY IN SUP, BUT IT BECOMES MORE OF A TRADITIONAL INDUSTRIAL AREA, AND THEN MAJOR ENTERTAINMENT IN A COLLEGE WOULD BE BY SUP.

THEY PREVIOUSLY WEREN'T ALLOWED IN INDUSTRIAL AT ALL.

MAYBE I MISSED IT SOMEWHERE, BUT I SEE SCHOOLS THERE LISTED.

YOU HAD IT LISTED ON THE PREVIOUS SLIDE TO MY RIGHT.

THAT'S TRUE. WHERE DO PRIVATE SCHOOLS FALL INTO ONE OF THESE CATEGORIES.

SO THERE'S AGAIN KIND OF LIKE THERE'S LAWS THAT PREEMPT US, AND GENERALLY WITH SCHOOLS PUBLIC WE JUST ALLOW THEM BY RIGHT.

VERY SIMILAR.

SO GENERALLY WHAT WE DO IS ZONING GENERALLY IS YOU'LL KEEP A SCHOOL OR RELIGIOUS INSTITUTES ARE SIMILAR.

YOU TREAT THEM THE SAME.

SO THEY'RE ALLOWED BY RIGHT.

PRIVATE SCHOOL THEY WOULD IT'S A LITTLE, IT'S A LITTLE DIFFERENT.

THERE'S A WHOLE BAG OF WORMS. YOU KNOW, I DON'T KNOW THAT I AM INTELLIGENT ENOUGH TO DIG INTO THAT BAG RIGHT NOW, BUT SCHOOLS AND CHURCHES GENERALLY ALLOW BY RIGHT IN EVERY DISTRICT.

IF IT'S A PRIVATE SCHOOL GENERALLY THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE TO IT CAN GET VERY HARD TO DEFINE WHAT'S PUBLIC, WHAT'S PRIVATE AND DIFFERENT THINGS.

SO THAT'S WHY YOU SEE SCHOOLS AND YOU SEE PUBLIC BY RIGHT.

PRIVATE WOULD GENERALLY HAVE TO COME BEFORE YOU BEFORE AS AN SUP.

THERE'S JUST OTHER IMPLICATIONS THERE THAT ARE [INAUDIBLE] JUMP IN FOR A SECOND. SO I'M ASHAMED THAT I CAN'T REMEMBER A NAME OF A SEMINAL CASE WHERE THIS OCCURRED, BUT,

[01:10:06]

PUBLIC SCHOOLS ARE ALLOWED TO PICK THE LOCATION TO CARRY OUT THEIR CONSTITUTIONAL DUTIES.

THEY ARE SUBDIVISION OF THE STATE OF TEXAS, MUCH LIKE WE ARE, AND THE COURTS ESSENTIALLY ALLOW THEM TO PICK THE LOCATION TO CARRY OUT THOSE DUTIES.

NOW, ONCE THEY DECIDE WHAT THEY'RE GOING TO DO WITH THAT PROPERTY, THEY HAVE TO FOLLOW OUR RULES, BUT THEY GO INTO GO, THEY GO AND GET TO DETERMINE WHAT THEY'RE GOING TO DO WITH THE PROPERTY, REGARDLESS OF WHAT OUR ZONING SAYS.

SO FAMOUS CASE AND AGAIN, I CAN'T REMEMBER REMEMBER IT WHERE THERE WAS A HEAVILY RESIDENTIAL AREA, THE SCHOOL WENT IN, SCHOOL DISTRICT WENT IN, WAS GOING TO PUT A BUS BARN THERE. NEIGHBORS WEREN'T HAPPY.

IT WAS NOT ZONED FOR THAT TYPE OF COMMERCIAL ACTIVITY AND MAYBE EVEN INDUSTRIAL ACTIVITY, BECAUSE THERE WAS GOING TO BE MAINTENANCE, AND I MEAN, YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE CREWS REPAIRING THE BUSSES AND THINGS LIKE THAT.

COURT CAME DOWN AND SAID NO SCHOOL DISTRICT AND CARRYING OUT ITS CONSTITUTIONAL DUTIES GETS TO PICK WHERE THAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN, BUT ONCE THEY DECIDE WHAT TYPE OF SITE IT IS, THEN THEY HAVE TO BECOME COMPLIANT WITH THAT TYPE OF SITE.

SO THAT'S WHY WHY ESSENTIALLY IT'S BY RIGHT IS REALLY DON'T, GET A SAY IN IT.

THEY GET TO PICK HOW THEY'RE GOING TO USE THE PROPERTY TO CARRY OUT THEIR DUTIES.

THAT'S PUBLIC SCHOOLS.

YEAH. PRIVATE SCHOOLS ARE.

IT'S A LITTLE BIT OF A GRAY AREA, ESPECIALLY SCHOOLS THAT HAVE RELIGIOUS, THAT ARE RELIGIOUS SCHOOLS IN SOME SORT DEPENDING ON THE SCHOOL ESPECIALLY IF IT'S RELIGIOUSLY AFFILIATED, WE ALSO MAY HAVE OUR HANDS TIED AND THEY WOULD HAVE A RIGHT BY THEY WOULD BE ABLE TO USE THE PROPERTY BY RIGHT BECAUSE OF FEDERAL LAW, AND JUST TO ADD TO THAT, COMMISSIONERS, OUR DEFINITION IN THE ZONING ORDINANCE DEFINES A SCHOOL AS A PRIVATE OR PUBLIC SCHOOLING FOR SECONDARY OR PRIMARY.

OKAY. SO BY RIGHT THEN SHOULD SCHOOLS SAY PUBLIC AND PRIVATE? WELL, BUT NOT ALL PRIVATE SCHOOLS ARE ENTITLED THE SAME.

BASICALLY THE LAW GIVES IF IT'S A RELIGIOUSLY ORIENTED SCHOOL, IT GETS TREATED DIFFERENTLY THAN IF IT'S A SECULAR PRIVATE SCHOOL AND SO THAT'S PROBABLY WHY IT'S NOT LISTED ACCORDINGLY.

DOES THAT MAKE SENSE? YOU KNOW, I WILL JUST I'LL JUST SENSE THAT YOU'RE SAYING THAT IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE THAT IT'S.

WELL, I WILL SAY ESPECIALLY IN ZONING LAW, THAT YOUR ZONING ORDINANCE IS THE FIRST PLACE THAT YOU START, BUT THERE ARE LITERALLY HUNDREDS AND HUNDREDS OF LAWS THAT INTERSECT WITH LAND USE AND THE LAWS THAT ARE GOING TO TRUMP OUR ZONING ORDINANCE, WHETHER IT'S FROM UTILITIES, WHERE THEY PUT THINK ABOUT WHERE, I CAN'T REMEMBER THE NAME OF THE FEDERAL ACT, BUT IF SOMEBODY WANTS TO PUT AN ELECTRIC SUBSTATION A PLACE, LOTS OF TIMES THEY GET TO DO IT REGARDLESS OF YOUR ZONING ORDINANCE SAYS, BECAUSE FEDERAL LAW WANTS THERE TO BE UTILITIES PROVIDED, AND, YOU KNOW, THERE'S SO WE GET TRUMPED IN A VARIETY OF WAYS, AND I THINK WHAT YOU'RE SEEING HERE IS THAT WE'RE TRYING TO INCORPORATE WHAT GENERALLY ARE WELL ACCEPTED TRUMP CARDS TO, TO OUR BASIC ZONING ORDINANCE.

CURRENTLY OUR ZONING IS A LITTLE DIFFERENT.

WE HAVE SCHOOLS AS SUP IN SOME DISTRICTS.

SO THIS IS KIND OF JUST BRINGING IT LIKE, YOU KNOW CITY ATTORNEY SAYING BRINGING IT MORE INTO LINE WITH WHAT'S GENERAL PRACTICE AND WHAT'S DEFENSIBLE, IF YOU WILL. THE WORST THING IS, SOMETIMES I HATE TO BRING IN AN SUP SOMETIMES AND SAY, YEAH, IT'S AN SUP, AND BY ORDINANCE IT LOOKS LIKE YOU GET A CHOICE, BUT YOU DON'T.

SORRY. SO SOME OF THOSE ARE TRYING TO ELIMINATE WHERE THEY JUST MAKE IT BY, RIGHT? SO IF IT'S A RELIGIOUS COLLEGE DOES IT GO BACK UP TO BY RIGHT? POTENTIALLY. POTENTIALLY.

YES. YEAH.

SO THE RELIGIOUS INSTITUTES JUST TO KIND OF TOUCH ON THAT.

OUR DEFINITIONS IF THE PRIMARY PRIMARY USE AND I DON'T WANT TO CONFUSE WITH SUP, BUT IF THE PRIMARY USE IS A CHURCH AND ONE OF THEIR SECONDARY FUNCTIONS IS SCHOOL, THEY'RE GOING TO BE APPROVED AS A RELIGIOUS INSTITUTE ON THEIR ZONING OR THE CO HOW YOU WANT IT, AND THEN THAT'S A SECONDARY USE THAT'S SUBORDINATE TO THE PRIMARY USE.

THANKS. ALL RIGHT.

SO THIS JUST KIND OF GOES BACK TO THE ZONING CODE DEFINITION.

SO ONE THING WE DID IS PROVIDED SOME CLARIFYING LANGUAGE RELATED TO ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS CURRENT CODE DOES ALLOW THEM, BUT THERE'S NO STANDARDS RELATED TO HOW THOSE ARE TO EXIST OR TO COME INTO BEING ALLOWED.

SO WE'VE PROVIDED SOME MINIMUM STANDARDS YOU CAN SEE THERE IS ONE THROUGH SEVEN UNDERNEATH.

SEE, ESSENTIALLY THIS ALLOWS THE HOMEOWNERS TO USE THEIR PROPERTY FOR GRANNY FLATS AND OTHER LAW SUITES, THOSE TYPE OF THINGS FAMILY, BUT IT DOES PROVIDE SOME PROTECTIONS ON HOW THOSE ADUS WOULD LOOK, AND I WOULD POINT OUT THERE'S ONLY A LIMIT OF ONE PER LOT.

SO SOMEBODY CAN'T COME AND PUT LIKE 18 ADUS IN THEIR BACKYARD AND CREATE A, YOU KNOW, TINY HOME SUBDIVISION OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT.

[01:15:06]

SO THIS EXAMPLE SPECIFICALLY, AS IF WE HAD LIQUOR STORES APPROVED BY A LOCAL OPTION ELECTION, ELECTION WE WANT TO HAVE STANDARDS.

HOW THAT WOULD LOOK, WHERE THOSE WOULD BE ALLOWED WE'VE PROVIDED SOME LAND USE CLASSIFICATIONS FOR THAT, AS WELL AS SOME SUPPLEMENTAL REGULATIONS.

IF THEY WERE GOING TO GO ON I-35 OR OLD TOWN, YOU KNOW, THEY'D HAVE TO GET A SPECIFIC USE PERMIT PRIOR TO THAT.

SO THAT'S THAT JUST COVERS THAT ENTIRELY THOSE AREAS, AND THEN THESE SUPPLEMENTAL REGULATIONS APPLY TO ANYTHING THAT WOULD GO INTO COMMERCIAL, GENERAL RETAIL OR INDUSTRIAL AS WELL.

SO IN THE COUNTY, YOU'LL SEE THE 300FT OF THE FRONTAGE.

IF IT'S ON THE I-35, WE'VE GOT A MINIMUM BUILDING SIZE FOR FIRE SPRINKLING, A DISTANCE BETWEEN LIQUOR STORES.

IF THEY WERE APPROVED NOT HAVING TO WALK UP OR DRIVE-THRU ACCESS ON THOSE HAVING A PARTITION MEAN THAT YOU'RE NOT GOING TO HAVE A, LET'S SAY, A GROCERY STORE WANTED TO HAVE A LIQUOR STORE.

IT COULDN'T BE COMMON INTEREST.

IT'D HAVE TO HAVE A PARTITION, SEPARATE WALL, SEPARATE ENTRANCES, ESSENTIALLY A SEPARATE BUSINESS AND THEN WE HAVE SOME STUFF ON THE WINDOWS, POLYCARBONATE OR SHATTERPROOF, AS WELL AS AN ADDITIONAL LANDSCAPING BUFFER.

SO THIS IS JUST KIND OF PROTECTIONS TO KIND OF GET THE QUALITY IF THIS WERE APPROVED.

SO THIS IS A, IF YOU WILL, PROTECTIVE MEASURE FOR US IN CASE THAT GOT APPROVED THROUGH THIS KIND OF GOES ALONG HANG ON JUST A SECOND.

YEAH. IS THERE ANYTHING IN CHISHOLM SUMMIT THAT WOULD REQUIRE AN SUP THAT WOULD NEED TO BE ADDRESSED? CHISHOLM SUMMIT REQUIRE AN SUP.

SO CHISHOLM THE FOR THIS FOR LIQUOR STORE.

SO CHISHOLM SUMMIT IS A PLANNED DEVELOPMENT.

SO THAT WOULD THEY'D HAVE TO AMEND THEIR ZONING TO PUT A LIQUOR STORE IN CHISHOLM SUMMIT.

SO PLANNED DEVELOPMENTS ARE KIND OF THESE IF THEY'RE WRITTEN A CERTAIN WAY AND THE WAY THAT ONE IS WRITTEN, IS IT THEIR USES ARE EXPLICITLY STATED IN THEIR ZONING.

SO IF THEY WERE WANTING TO PUT A LIQUOR STORE IN SOMEWHERE IN CHISHOLM SUMMIT, THEY WOULD HAVE TO OPEN UP THE PD AND COME BACK BEFORE YOU.

THAT'D BE A ZONE CHANGE YES, AND WE'D HAVE NOTICING ALL THE NORMAL STUFF ARE ZONING SO THIS IS ONE THING THAT IS DIFFERENT.

SO STAFF INTENDS TO KIND OF MOVE FORWARD.

YOU'RE MORE THAN LIKELY GOING TO SEE A TEXT AMENDMENT FOR THE LIQUOR STORE SUPPLEMENTAL REGULATIONS BEFORE YOU SEE THE FULL ZONING CODE, AND THAT'S JUST THE ZONING CODE IS GOING TO TAKE A LITTLE LONGER THAN THAT PORTION, AND WE'D LIKE TO HAVE IT ON THE BOOKS PRIOR TO IF IN A LOCAL ELECTION HAPPENED AND IT WASN'T APPROVED.

WE DON'T WANT TO BE BEHIND THE GAME ON THAT.

SO WE'RE JUST TRYING TO BE PROACTIVE INSTEAD OF REACTIONARY ON THAT.

SO THAT'S JUST SOME PROPOSED DATES THAT YOU COULD POTENTIALLY SEE THAT.

IT WAS QUICK.

FOR THE MAY 2024 ELECTION.

THE. THE LIQUOR.

IS THERE EVEN A CHANCE IT'S NOT GOING TO MAKE IT? I CAN'T, I HAVE NO IDEA.

NO COMMENT ON THAT. I JUST WE AS PLANNERS WANT TO BE PROACTIVE IN CASE IT WAS APPROVED.

I THE VOTERS VOTE HOW THE VOTERS WILL VOTE.

I HAVE NO IDEA. OH NO I MEANT TIME-WISE BECAUSE RIGHT NOW IF THEY'RE DOING PETITIONS AND STUFF RIGHT NOW TRYING TO GET SIGNATURES, I KNOW THERE'S A YEAH, I DON'T THINK THAT I'M READY TO COMMENT ON THAT.

I DON'T HAVE THAT DATA. I MISSED YOUR QUESTION, BILL.

I'M SORRY. SO THEY HAVE UNTIL THE BEGINNING OF FEBRUARY, I THINK IT'S FEBRUARY THE 5TH IS THE DATE TO PRODUCE THOSE, LIST OF VOTERS THAT SIGNED THAT PETITION SO THAT THE CITY SECRETARY CAN CONFIRM THAT THEY ARE REGISTERED VOTERS TO PUT THIS ON THE ON THE BALLOT FOR MAY.

SO THERE'S STILL I MEAN, EVEN IF THEY GOT THE NUMBERS, THEY COULD STILL MAKE THE BALLOT.

I WAS THINKING THAT THERE THERE MIGHT THE TIMELINE MIGHT HAVE PASSED.

NO, THEY CAN STILL MAKE THEORETICALLY THEY CAN STILL, MAKE ALL THE DEADLINES.

I THINK YOU HAVE TO CALL THE ELECTION BY FEBRUARY 16TH.

FEBRUARY. YEAH. SOMETIME.

YEAH, THAT COULD END UP ON THE BALLOT IF EVERYTHING'S TURNED OUT.

THAT'S A LOT OF ASSUMPTIONS, BUT YES, THEY STILL HAVE TIME TO MAKE IT.

YEAH, I DIDN'T BRUSH UP ON IT, BUT I WAS THINKING THAT THERE WAS WHEN IT WAS TURNED INTO CITY SECRETARY, THAT SHE HAD 30 DAYS OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT TO COMPLY.

NO, THERE'S NOT I MEAN, MY UNDERSTANDING, I DON'T ACTUALLY THINK THERE'S A AMOUNT OF TIME GIVEN THE LAW.

THE LAW THINKS THAT THEY'RE INSTANTLY CHECKED IN SOME LEVEL BUT I THINK THERE'S BEEN DISCUSSIONS WITH THE PETITIONER IN THIS SITUATION.

OBVIOUSLY, THERE HAS TO BE SOME AMOUNT OF TIME TO PROCESS THOSE THINGS.

OKAY, AND MAYBE JUST IT'S ONLY A PERCENTAGE OF THE OF THE PEOPLE THAT VOTED IN THE LAST ELECTION.

YEAH. I DON'T WANT TO I DON'T WANT TO GET TOO OFF TOPIC ON FROM THE ZONING CODE BECAUSE THAT'S NOT MY AREA OF EXPERTISE.

THOSE ARE BETTER FIELDED PROBABLY BY THE CITY SECRETARY WHAT I WOULD SAY IS.

[01:20:05]

EVEN IF THIS GETS ADOPTED, THE TEXT AMENDMENT, IT COULD BE ON THE BOOKS FOR YEARS BEFORE THAT LOCAL OPTION, SAY GOT APPROVED.

JUST BECAUSE IT'S IN OUR ZONING CODE JUST PROTECTS, PREPARES US FOR IF AND WHEN.

IT DOESN'T MEAN THAT SOMEBODY CAN AUTOMATICALLY BUILD IT BECAUSE IT'S IN THE ZONING CODE.

THERE'S A LOT OF CITIES WILL HAVE LIQUOR STORE REGULATIONS, AND THEY HAVEN'T EVEN HAD A LOCAL, YOU KNOW, ON THE BOOKS FOR YEARS, AND THEY HAVEN'T APPROVED A LOCAL OPTION ON THAT YET. SO AND I HAD SOME OTHER QUESTIONS ON IT, AND I DON'T KNOW IF YOU'RE NEAR THE END OF THIS PRESENTATION, THERE'S GOING TO BE ON THE LIQUOR.

SO AGAIN, IF IT'S RELATED TO ZONING, I CAN ANSWER YOUR QUESTIONS IF IT'S RELATED TO HOW THE ELECTION, I KNOW IT'S NOT GOING TO BE ON THAT.

I DIDN'T KNOW IF YOU WANT TO WAIT TILL THE END OF YOUR PRESENTATION.

NO, NO. BY ALL MEANS, GO AHEAD.

OKAY. DID STAFF PUT THIS TOGETHER? DID OTHER GROUPS OR OUTSIDERS OR CITY COUNCIL OR ANYBODY ELSE? THESE WERE THIS STARTED AS PROPOSALS.

THIS IS SOMETHING I DRAFTED BASED OFF LOOKING AT OTHER CITIES AND OTHER MUNICIPALITIES THAT HAVE KIND OF GONE THROUGH THE SIMILAR THINGS AND HAVE NOW ALLOWED THEM.

THEN THERE WAS FEEDBACK FROM OBVIOUSLY STAFF, COUNCIL AS WELL AS CITY MANAGEMENT'S OFFICE.

SO IT'S KIND OF BEEN VETTED THROUGH ON OUR END.

YEAH, THAT'S JUST WHEN I READ THROUGH IT BRIEFLY, THERE WERE A COUPLE THINGS THAT JUMPED OUT, LIKE THE THE INTERNATIONAL FIRE CODE BEING TYPICALLY LIKE RESIDENTIAL AND STUFF AT 6000FT². I NOTICED THIS ISN'T ABOUT 7500.

SO I WAS CONFUSED.

ARE THEY SAYING THE BUILDING NEEDS TO BE 7500FT² OR BIGGER.

SO THE MINIMUM SIZE OF THE BUILDING IS NOT BECAUSE THAT'S NOT TRYING TO SAY THAT'S WHAT THE FIRE CODE IS.

IT'S JUST SAYING AS AN ADD ON THAT WOULD REQUIRE SPRINKLING IN THE BUILDING BECAUSE OF THE MINIMUM SIZE OF THE BUILDING.

OKAY, AND THEN I ALSO SAW SOMETHING ABOUT TREES, ANY LIQUOR STORE I'VE EVER BEEN TO IN THE PAST OR PAST WHEN I'VE DRIVEN BY IT, I'VE NEVER SEEN TREES IN A PARKING LOT.

WELL, THIS IS BURLESON.

YOU KNOW, THIS IS OUR CITY, RIGHT? SO IF WE WANT TREES, WE CAN REQUIRE TREES.

SO, I THINK WE FROM PLANNING STAFF FROM, YOU KNOW, I WANT THINGS TO LOOK PRETTY.

IT'S NOT MY CITY, BUT, YOU KNOW, MY GOAL IS TO KIND OF PROVIDE SOME INPUT, AND I THINK DEPENDING ON THE DIFFERENT, THEY COME IN A VARIETY OF USES THAT PROVIDES A CANOPY, TREES, A LANDSCAPE BUFFER MAKES THINGS LOOK PRETTY, I UNDERSTAND.

SO, YOU KNOW, WE CAN PUT THAT DOWN IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE TREES, BUT NO.

THE ONLY THING I'M THINKING OF IS WHEN I WAS READING THIS, IT'S ALMOST LIKE SOMEBODY CAME FORWARD IS MAKING IT RESTRICTIVE TO SOMEBODY ELSE THAT MAY ALREADY HAVE AN EXISTING BUILDING OR AN EXISTING PROPERTY.

THAT WASN'T THE INTENT. THE INTENT WAS JUST TO HOW DO WE PROVIDE AND MAKE IT LOOK PRETTY? SO IT'S JUST NOT A SQUARE BUILDING WITH A LOGO ON IT YOU KNOW, WHAT DOES IT LOOK LIKE FROM THE PEDESTRIAN RIGHT OF WAY? AND SO WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE USES AND POTENTIAL, YOU KNOW, WHAT COULD THIS USE ATTRACT OR WHAT COULD BE THERE? HOW DO WE MAKE THAT LOOK NICE FROM THE PEDESTRIAN VIEW.

YEAH, AND THEN A COUPLE PEOPLE ASKED ME, AND I'M PRETTY SURE THE WORDS I DON'T KNOW AND YOU PROBABLY DON'T KNOW EITHER IF THIS DID PASS, HOW MANY LIQUOR STORES COULD BURLESON HAVE SO THEY COULD HAVE AS MANY AS THE PLANNING, ZONING AND CITY COUNCIL APPROVED IN OLD TOWN OR I-35 NOT TO BE WITHIN 300FT OF EACH OTHER.

I ALSO HAVE TO MEET THE STATE REQUIREMENTS FROM DISTANCE FROM SCHOOLS AND WHATNOT.

SO THERE'S OTHER PREEMPTIVE LAWS.

SO TO DO THAT MATH, I THINK THE MARKET THE MARKET IS GOING TO LIMIT IT.

YOU KNOW, I DON'T THINK BURLESON COULD SUSTAIN 55 LIQUOR STORES, BUT YOU MIGHT GEOGRAPHICALLY, TECHNICALLY BE ABLE TO PUT 55 IF YOU, YOU KNOW, GET ALL THE STRINGS AND WE START PUTTING STICKY NOTES ALL OVER A MAP, BUT I HAVEN'T DONE THAT MATH TO TELL YOU EXACTLY HOW MANY.

IF EVERYBODY DECIDED TO CONVERT TO A LIQUOR STORE.

I WENT CHRISTMAS SHOPPING THE OTHER DAY AND SAW A LIQUOR STORE SIGNED BY HOUSE OF PHO OR WHATEVER. YES, THAT'S TRUE.

I KNOW THAT'S IN TARRANT COUNTY.

YES, BUT, AND SO IT'S LIKE THAT THEY COULD JUST START POPPING UP, WITHIN REASON.

YEAH.

COMMISSIONER JANUSCH, IF I COULD JUST INTERRUPT TO ADD TO YOUR QUESTION EARLIER ABOUT, STAKEHOLDER OR COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT.

SO WE DO INTEND TO ENGAGE OUR COMMUNITY STAKEHOLDERS WITH MEETINGS AND GET THEIR INPUT ON THIS BEFORE IT COMES TO YOU AND CITY COUNC IL, SO THAT WE CAN INCORPORATE THOSE CHANGES THAT THEY WOULD LIKE TO SEE AS WELL.

SO THIS IS YOUR FIRST OPPORTUNITY TO GET A REALLY GOOD LOOK AT IT AND MAYBE GET THE WHEELS ROLLING TO THINK ABOUT POSSIBLE CHANGES THAT YOU'D LIKE TO SEE THAT WE CAN INCORPORATE.

YEAH, YEAH, AND LIKE I SAID, IT WAS JUST MY FIRST LOOK AT IT.

IT JUST THINGS POPPED IN MY HEAD REAL QUICK, AND I KNOW ANYTIME YOU HEAR ABOUT LIQUOR, LIKE YOU SAID, THE THE INDUSTRIAL, I MEAN, THEN THERE'S A CHANCE OF A TOTALLY NEW BAR.

SO THAT'S AN SOB. SO THAT'S A DIFFERENT USE.

YEAH. THIS WOULD BE LIKE A SPECS OR A TOTAL WINE.

THOSE TYPE OF ESTABLISHMENTS.

[01:25:02]

SO THIS IS BYOB.

THIS IS A PACKAGE THAT'S A DIFFERENT I JUST WANT TO CLARIFY.

THAT'S A TOTALLY DIFFERENT USE OKAY.

THAT IS A SEXUALLY ORIENTED BUSINESS, NOT A PACKAGE OR LIQUOR STORE.

YEAH, AND THEN SOME OF THESE OTHER WHERE YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT PARTITION WALLS AND STUFF I BELIEVE SOME OF THAT'S ALREADY COVERED IN TABC GUIDELINES.

THAT IS CORRECT. SO I LOOKED AT THOSE GUIDELINES AS I DRAFTED THE INITIAL RECOMMENDATIONS.

SO SOME OF THAT IS JUST TO CLARIFY.

SO STAFF GETS A LOT OF INQUIRIES ABOUT THINGS THAT ARE COVERED IN STATE LAW.

SO SOMETIMES IT'S PRUDENT TO PUT SOME OF THOSE IN BLACK AND WHITE SO IT'S JUST AND THEY WOULD SUPERSEDE WHAT BURLESON PUT FORTH IF THE STATE CHANGED SOME LAWS I DON'T WANT TO SPEAK IN REVERSE, BUT IF THE STATE HAD A MORE RESTRICTIVE AND THEY SAID A LIQUOR STORES CAN'T BE WITHIN 5000FT OF A SCHOOL THEN THEY WOULDN'T TABC WOULDN'T ISSUE THE PERMIT.

OKAY. IF WE DO PERMIT NEW BARS, I WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY HAVE TREES ON.

[CHUCKLING] WE HAVE UPDATED THE LANDSCAPING CODE AS WELL, SO WE WANT TO HAVE TREES OUT FRONT OF EVERYWHERE IS THE GOAL AND ONE ON SOMETHING ELSE EARLIER YOU HAD MENTIONED A BASIC BASIC UTILITIES.

DOES THAT INCLUDE WASTEWATER TREATMENT PLANTS? NO. SO WE'RE TALKING LIKE EASEMENTS, SEWER WATER LINES JUST A BASIC UTILITIES.

SO WHAT YOU DON'T SEE IS SOME OF THE MORE DEFINITIONS IS SOME OF THOSE BECAUSE I DIDN'T WANT TO KILL YOU WITH 400 SLIDES, BUT THAT WOULD THAT'S A DIFFERENT USE.

THAT'S NOT A BASIC UTILITY.

OKAY. I'M JUST TRYING TO COVER THESE BASES AS THEY POP IN MY HEAD.

SURE. FOR THE LIQUOR STORES.

IS IT, I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE WE'RE NOT GOING TO HAVE THEM IN STRIP CENTERS, PER SE.

IT'S GOING TO BE BASICALLY JUST A FREESTANDING.

IT COULD POTENTIALLY GO INTO A STRIP CENTER IF THE WALLS ARE PARTITIONED AND THEY MEET ALL THE OTHER REQUIREMENTS.

SO THAT'S PART OF THE WHY YOU SEE THE 7500 SQUARE FOOT.

SO GENERALLY A STRIP CENTER IS NOT GOING TO HAVE A 7500 SQUARE FOOT SPACE FOR THEM IT ALSO WOULD PROHIBIT THEM GOING TO MAYBE AN OLDER STYLE METAL BUILDING WHERE THERE'S INTERNAL DOORS AND THEY DON'T HAVE THAT FIRE CODE SEPARATION.

SO IT'S NOT PARTITIONED.

SO IT KIND OF KEEPS THEM FROM PROLIFERATING IN PLACES YOU MAY NOT WANT TO SEE THEM.

THAT BEING SAID, IF SOMEBODY BUILDS A STRIP STRIP RETAIL AND THE END USER IS 7500 SQUARE FOOT, YOU KNOW, JUST LIKE WHEN YOU GO TO FORT WORTH ARLINGTON, TOTAL WINE'S USUALLY NEXT TO A WORLD MARKET AND A BARNES AND NOBLE, AND, YOU KNOW, YOU JUST GO IN ONE AND OUT THE OTHER, BUT THIS WOULD THEY'D STILL HAVE TO MEET ALL THE REQUIREMENTS OF THIS. SO YOU'RE PROBABLY NOT GOING TO SEE THIS GO INTO AN OLD GAMESTOP THAT'S LIKE 800 SQUARE FOOT ON THE INSIDE, IF THAT MAKES SENSE.

YEAH. SOME OF THESE COMMERCIAL STRIP CENTERS, THE SHEETROCK, THE FIREWALLS AND STUFF LIKE THAT WERE DONE DIFFERENT BANK TODAY.

SO IF A DIFFERENT BUSINESS MOVES IN LIKE A LIQUOR STORE WHERE THEY HAVE TO UPGRADE AND DO LIKE A DOUBLE WALL, DOUBLE FIREWALL.

SO THE BUILDING OFFICIAL WOULD REVIEW IT AND THEY WOULD GO OUT AND DO I DON'T WANT TO, YOU KNOW, WRITE A CHECK THAT I CAN'T CASH FOR THE BUILDING OFFICIAL BUT IF THEY MET ALL THE SUPPLEMENTAL REGULATIONS AND THEY HAD THE ZONING IN PLACE AND IT WAS A PARTITION WALL, SEPARATE ENTRANCES, THEN THEY COULD, IN THEORY, GO IN THERE.

YEAH. WE'RE NOT I GUESS WE'RE NOT PROOFING AGAINST, LIKE, THE HULK OR THE JUGGERNAUT.

LIKE BUSTING THROUGH A WALL, YOU KNOW, BUT WE DON'T WANT A CUSTOMER TO BE ABLE TO GO IN ONE AND WALK INTO THE OTHER.

IT'S GOT TO BE A SEPARATE, PARTITIONED ENTRANCE ENTRANCE.

YEAH, BECAUSE SOME OF THESE BUILDINGS I'VE DONE WORK ON WHERE THEY WERE SET UP FOR COMMERCIAL WHEN THEY, IF THEY WERE GOING TO DO ANY KIND OF RETAIL.

ALSO, YOU HAD TO DO THE DOUBLE WALL AND STUFF ALL THESE THINGS.

YOU ADDED 70, 80 GRAND, 100 GRAND TO THE RENOVATIONS AND IT GOT RIDICULOUS WHERE IT WASN'T COST EFFECTIVE.

YEAH. SO THERE MAY BE AN INSTANCE WHERE SOMEBODY CAN REMOVE A WALL TO MAKE THIS WORK, AND OR ADD, YOU KNOW, CLOSE UP AN ENTRYWAY OR DOORWAY AND DO SOME MINOR WORK TO MAKE IT WORK, BUT IT WOULD STILL HAVE TO MEET THE OTHER REQUIREMENTS.

NOW THE BACK DOOR, IF YOU HAD A WIDE ENOUGH BUILDING, WOULD YOU STILL HAVE TO HAVE A BACK DOOR? IF SO, YOU'RE KIND OF GETTING INTO THE INTERNATIONAL BUILDING CODE REQUIREMENTS.

SO THERE'S THINGS IN THERE AS FAR AS THE EXIT AND THE SIDEWALKS HAVE TO CONNECT FROM THE FIRE EGRESS AND LIGHTING.

THE ZONING CODE DOESN'T NECESSARILY COVER ALL THOSE MINUTE DETAILS.

THOSE ARE COVERED IN THE BUILDING CODE, WHICH WE ADOPT IN OTHER PARTS OF THE CITY CODE.

SO ANY BUILDING OR ANY USE THAT'S NEW BUILDING WILL HAVE TO MEET THE 2021 BUILDING CODE.

ANY EXISTING BUILDING.

THE BUILDING OFFICIAL HAS SOME DISCRETION AND WHAT IS HAS TO BE UPGRADED TO THE CURRENT BUILDING CODE.

SO IF IT'S A VERY OLD BUILDING AND THEY'RE NOT TOUCHING THAT BARRIER, THEY MAY NOT HAVE TO BRING THAT PART UP, BUT THAT'S A FUNCTION OUTSIDE OF THE ZONING

[01:30:05]

YEAH. SO SOME OF SOME OF THOSE THINGS ARE A LITTLE OUTSIDE THE ZONING CODE, BUT I UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE SAYING.

YEAH. THE DELIVERY TRUCKS AND WHATNOT.

SO FOR NEW BUILDS AND NEW SITE PLANS WE LOOK AT, THEY'RE REQUIRED TO HAVE LOADING AND UNLOADING SPACES, AND THOSE ARE THINGS THAT WE ARE WE CAN ENFORCE SOMETIMES WHEN IT'S A RENOVATION, A TENANT REMODEL OR A TENANT IMPROVEMENT, IF THEY DON'T TRIGGER SITE PLAN, THEN WE MAY NOT BE ABLE TO LEGALLY COMPEL THEM TO DO SOME OF THE THINGS YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT.

WE CAN'T JUST THERE'S THINGS THAT YOU WOULD LOVE TO HAVE, BUT WE HAVE TO HAVE SOMETHING TO COMPEL THE APPLICANT TO DO IT.

YOU KNOW, FINANCIALLY, WE CAN'T JUST SAY YOU HAVE TO DO IT BECAUSE WE WOULD LIKE IT.

IT'S GOT TO BE THEY HAVE TO TRIGGER THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE CODE, AND GOOD NEWS, I THINK I GOT ONE LAST QUESTION.

NO, NO WORRIES. OUT OF ALL THE GROUPS THAT INTERJECTED ON THIS, WAS THERE ANYONE THAT STOOD OUT THAT EITHER.

PUTS IN, WANTED TO PUT IN SPECIFIC LANGUAGE OR ASK A LOT OF QUESTIONS LIKE, LIKE WHAT I DO? ARE YOU ASKING ABOUT THE PRESENTATION OF COUNCIL? SO I WOULD THEY'RE ALL RECORDED.

I WOULD RECOMMEND YOU WATCH THE NOVEMBER 13TH MEETING.

I DON'T KNOW THAT I HAVE ANY COMMENT ON THAT THE MEETINGS RECORDED AND FOR THE PUBLIC, ANYBODY CAN WATCH THAT MEETING AND SEE WHAT COMMENTS WERE OR WEREN'T MADE BY ANYBODY, AND I WAS AT THAT WHEN I DIDN'T KNOW IF THIS, BUT IF ANY OF THESE CONVERSATIONS MIGHT HAVE TOOK PLACE IN EXECUTIVE SESSION.

SO I'M NOT GOING TO COMMENT ON THAT BECAUSE I DON'T HAVE THAT ANSWER.

WHAT I CAN TELL YOU IS THAT THE PUBLIC PORTIONS ARE RECORDED.

THE THINGS THAT I DRAFTED HERE, I DRAFTED AT MY DESK WITH NOBODY WAS PRESSURING ME OVER MY SHOULDER.

THEY ARE OF MY OWN FRUITION, AND THEY WERE ROUTED UP FOR REVIEW, YOU KNOW, THROUGH MY DEPARTMENT, UP THROUGH EVERYBODY.

SO ANY PRIVATE CONVERSATIONS THAT I HAD, I WASN'T PRIVY TO.

SO I CAN'T COMMENT.

OKAY. YEAH. LIKE I SAID, JUST JUST BY LOOKING AT IT, I JUST WANT TO ELIMINATE OUT OF MY BRAIN AND MY TRAIN OF THOUGHT THAT MOST OF THESE I DRAFTED, IF THAT'S WHAT YOU'RE ASKING, THAT NOBODY TOLD ME TO WRITE THE 20 FOOT AND THE 15 THAT CAME FROM LIDON PEARCE'S BRAIN, THAT WASN'T DICTATED TO ME.

SO. OKAY, AND I TRUST YOU WITH THAT OR I TRUST YOU WITH NOT HAVING.

WE'RE OPEN IF YOU HAVE RECOMMENDATIONS.

THAT'S WHAT THIS IS ABOUT.

SO IF YOU SO THIS WILL COME BACK BEFORE US AGAIN, THOUGH IT WILL.

SO IT WILL COME BACK FOR YOU FOR AN ACTION.

THERE'S NO ACTION TONIGHT.

THIS IS JUST A BRIEF.

SO IT'LL COME BACK FOR AN OFFICIAL ACTION AT A LATER DATE.

NOW, IF ONE OF US HAD A RECOMMENDATION, DO WE HAVE TO DO IT AS A BODY OR CAN WE SUBMIT IT TO YOU GUYS AS A SO THIS IS A REPORT AND PRESENTATION.

SO IF YOU HAD A RECOMMENDATION, YOU COULD TELL ME RIGHT NOW RIGHT ON MY NOTEPAD, AND NOW WHETHER COUNCIL ADOPTS THAT OR THE P&Z AS A BODY RECOMMENDS THAT, YOU KNOW, I CAN'T SPEAK TO THAT.

THAT'S UP TO.

YEAH. THIS IS NOT AN ACTION ITEM LISTED ON TONIGHT'S AGENDA.

SO IT'S JUST INDIVIDUAL FEEDBACK.

YEAH. THAT'S WHAT I HOPE. THAT'S WHAT I WAS HOPING IT WAS BECAUSE IT'S SOMETHING THAT I WOULD SHOOT AWAY IF YOU IF YOU HAVE SOMETHING I HAVE A PEN AND PLENTY OF PAPER RIGHT HERE.

SO NO, NO I'M FINE WITH THAT.

SOMETHING I WOULD DIGEST AND REALLY THINK IT THROUGH, AND I JUST THE MAIN THING WITH ALL THE QUESTIONS, I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE THERE WAS NOT A ONE PERSON OR TWO PERSON OR THREE PERSON SELFISH AGENDA THAT WAS PUSHING FORTH THE FRIEND OR RELATIVES OR OR THEIR I'LL FALL ON THE SWORD FOR ANYTHING YOU DON'T LIKE ON THE SUPPLEMENTAL REGULATIONS.

SO WE'RE GOOD AND I APPRECIATE YOUR TIME.

THANKS. NO. NO WORRIES.

YES, I DO HAVE ONE MORE QUESTION.

YES, SIR. THE 7500FT² WOULD KIND OF LIMIT THE SMALL GUY THAT WANTS TO OPEN LIQUOR STORE, YOU KNOW? I MEAN, I CAN'T SPEAK TO THEIR FINANCIAL CAPABILITIES, BUT IF SOMEBODY DIDN'T HAVE THE FUNDS TO OPEN UP A FACILITY THAT LARGE, THAT'S PRETTY LARGE LIQUOR STORE. SURE.

I MEAN, I'M NOT SURE EXACTLY HOW BIG THAT IS, BUT I DON'T THINK IT'S THAT BIG.

SO YOU GOT THE SPECS? I'VE HAD SPECS.

I DON'T EVEN KNOW HOW BIG SPECS WOULD BE.

20,000FT², PROBABLY.

OKAY. I MEAN, THAT'S AND THEY'RE FIXING BUILDING SPECS.

YEAH, RIGHT OVER HERE, I'M GUESSING, BUT THIS WAS THE PLACE.

THE THOUGHT PROCESS WAS YOUR 800 SQUARE FOOT, YOUR TINY SPACES.

THAT WAS THE THOUGHT PROCESS THERE.

THE THOUGHT PROCESS WASN'T TO MARGINALIZE ANYBODY, BUT MOST LIQUOR STORES ARE THERE.

THEY ARE, AS YOU SAID, MUCH LARGER THAN 70 500 SQUARE FOOT.

YOU TALK ABOUT STORAGE AREAS, BACK ROOMS, BATHROOMS BECAUSE OF THE FIRE SPRINKLER REQUIREMENTS.

THAT'S JUST A NOTE THAT THE LIQUOR STORE, IF WE GO 7500, IT'S GOING TO REQUIRE SPRINKLING, WHICH IS AN ADDITIONAL COST.

THAT'S ALL THAT NOTE IS THERE.

THAT'S NOT TO INFER THAT'S THE INTERNATIONAL FIRE CODE REQUIREMENT.

THAT IS JUST JUST SO IT'S VERY UPFRONT.

IF SOMEBODY WAS GOING TO BUILD A FACILITY, THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE TO SPRINKLE THE BUILDING, AND THAT'S NOT THE TRICKS LIKE ON LIVING SPACE OR AIR CONDITIONED SPACE.

[01:35:02]

SO WHEN YOU START TALKING ABOUT THEIR STORAGE AREAS, IF THEY GOT A WALK IN HUMIDOR BATHROOMS, THOSE BUILDINGS ARE MUCH LARGER.

THIS ISN'T JUST RETAIL SPACE.

THIS IS GROSS FLOOR.

THAT'S THE WAY IT SHOULD BE.

YEAH, YEAH. I NOTED UNDER YOUR SUPPLEMENTAL REGULATIONS, YOU'VE GOT THE 300FT², THE 300FT FROM OUR LIQUOR STORE TO THE RESPECTIVE PROPERTY LINES. WHAT IS THE STATE REQUIREMENT FOR SCHOOLS? I IT'S.

YEAH. CAN WE AND CAN WE MAKE IT MORE RESTRICTIVE SO WE CAN MAKE IT.

WE CAN'T DECREASE IT.

WE CAN INCREASE THAT DISTANCE.

SO THIS IS I BELIEVE IT'S WHAT THE STATE HAS IS WHAT I'VE PUT IN THERE, BUT I DON'T HAVE THAT IN FRONT OF ME.

I DON'T WANT TO. THE ATTORNEY GENERAL.

EXCUSE ME? THE ATTORNEY.

STATE ATTORNEY'S OFFICE PUTS OUT RECOMMENDATIONS ON HOW TO DISTANCE CHECK PARTICULAR PROTECTED USES, SUCH AS A SCHOOL OR A DAYCARE AND I BELIEVE FOR SCHOOLS IT'S PROPERTY LINE TO PROPERTY LINE AS THE CROW FLIES.

SO THERE ARE OTHER DISTANCES THAT ARE FRONT DOOR TO FRONT DOOR FROM ROADWAYS AND THINGS, BUT AND FOR SCHOOLS IT'S A LITTLE MORE RESTRICTIVE.

SO THEY GO AS THE CROW FLIES PROPERTY LINE TO PROPERTY LINE.

YEAH. I WAS JUST I WAS JUST TOLD AN EXAMPLE, SAY JACK IN THE BOX WENT BELLY UP AND SOMEBODY DECIDED THEY WANTED TO PUT A LIQUOR STORE THERE.

MOUNDS RIGHT BEHIND IT, CATTY CORNERED ACROSS THE STREET.

YEAH, 300FT PROBABLY WOULD BE PUSHING IT.

YEAH. SO WE WOULD TAKE WHAT WE DO IS WHEN THOSE REQUESTS COME IN NOW FOR JUST A BEER AND WINE LICENSE, WE GO OUT AND MAP AND WE HAVE TO GO FROM THE PROPERTY LINES AND WE MEASURE THAT. SO AND THAT GOES TO THE CITY SECRETARY AND THEY PROVIDE THAT INFORMATION BEFORE THEY GET PERMITTING FROM TABC SO GENERALLY THE EASIEST WAY FOR US TO DO IT IS THE PROPERTY LINE, BECAUSE FRONT DOORS CAN MOVE BUILDINGS CAN ADJUST.

SO WE'VE, WE'VE PUT IN HERE PROPERTY LINE AND PROPERTY LINE.

YEAH. MY CONCERN WAS, YOU KNOW, THE 1000FT SOUNDS REASONABLE BUT 300FT, THEY COULD BACK, YOU KNOW, ACROSS THE STREET, AND YOU'D END UP WITH A LIQUOR STORE ON THE CORNER THERE AT 174, WITH MOUND OUT THE BACK DOOR WITHIN THE 300FT LEVEL.

I THINK THE 300FT WAS JUST FOR LIQUOR STORE, LIQUOR STORE.

SO IT IS SAME RULES WILL APPLY, WHICH I DON'T KNOW WHAT IT IS, BUT IT'S LIKE 1000 OR 2000, 8000.

I MEAN LIKE IT'S A, IT'S A PRETTY RESTRICTED THING BY THE TIME YOU INCLUDE I DON'T KNOW WHAT ALL IT IS, BUT [INAUDIBLE] CHURCHES, DAYCARE, SCHOOLS, ALL OF THESE THINGS WHERE LIKE, KIDS CAN BE IT'S PRETTY RESTRICTIVE, WHICH I THINK WOULD SUPERSEDE ANYTHING.

THAT IS CORRECT.

WE ARE NOT WE CAN'T DECREASE THOSE DISTANCES.

THIS IS JUST FROM ONE LIQUOR STORE TO ANOTHER.

YEAH. NO, NO, I JUST, I JUST WANT TO MAKE IT CLEAR IN CASE SOMEBODY, YOU KNOW, IS LISTENING IN OR WATCHES THE VIDEO THAT 300 IS JUST SO WE DON'T YOU DON'T HAVE A 18 LIQUOR STORES RIGHT IN A ROW IF YOU WOULD, AND ONE OTHER THING, DOES THIS INCLUDE ANY OTHER STATE FUNDED BUSINESSES OR I KNOW CHURCHES AND SCHOOLS AND STUFF.

I GET CHURCHES IF WE AREN'T STATE FUNDED, BUT YOU KNOW, THEY DO HAVE SCHOOLS.

YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT WHAT'S IN THE TABC, THE STATE REQUIREMENTS OF THE DISTANCE.

I DON'T HAVE IT IN FRONT OF ME.

I DON'T WANT TO ON THE RECORD.

I DON'T WANT TO SAY SOMETHING THAT'S NOT CORRECT, BUT IT IS.

IT IS ALL IN THERE, AND SO THEY STILL HAVE TO COMPLY WITH ALL THOSE IS WHETHER I DON'T KNOW THAT IT'S SO MUCH WHETHER THEY'RE STATE FUNDED OR NOT.

I THINK IT JUST SAYS CHURCHES, SCHOOLS.

I DON'T THINK IT DIFFERENTIATES BETWEEN THE FUNDING.

YEAH, BECAUSE IT'S ONE THING THAT I THINK EVERYBODY UP HERE WANTS TO MAKE SURE AND OFFER AS MUCH PROTECTION TO ANY OF THE SCHOOLS OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

YEAH. WE WOULDN'T YEAH, WE THEY WOULD STILL HAVE TO COMPLY WITH ALL STATE REGULATIONS AND LAWS.

OKAY. ANYTHING ELSE ON THIS ONE BEFORE I MOVE ON.

ALL RIGHT. I'LL INTERJECT REAL QUICK.

WE HAVE A SPEAKER CARD OKAY.

YEAH. GO AHEAD AND COME UP.

SORRY, I WASN'T A PUBLIC HEARING, SO I WASN'T SURE.

I JUST WANTED TO STATE MANDATES THAT YOU HAVE TO LET ALL SPEAKERS GO.

CATHERINE REDDING 201 MEANDERING LANE I HAVE A QUESTION FOR STAFF AND IT REALLY JUST HAS TO DO WITH THE LAND USE PORTION.

SO WHILE YOU'RE EXAMINING THAT WITH THE LAND USE, IS IT GOING TO BE SECONDARY OR PRIMARY? AND LET ME EXPLAIN.

IF YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE AN EXISTING STORE.

RIGHT. LET'S TAKE H-E-B FOR AN EXAMPLE.

AS A RETAIL, ARE THOSE LAND USES GOING TO BE WOULD THAT BE SECONDARY TO H-E-B BEING THE PRIMARY AS A GROCERY COMPONENT? AND DO YOU HAVE ANYTHING INCORPORATED IN THE SUPPLEMENTAL REGULATIONS FOR EXISTING STORES? SO FOR EXAMPLE I UNDERSTAND SO FAR OKAY.

SO FOR AND I'LL GIVE YOU A COMPARISON OR WHAT I'VE THOUGHT ABOUT JUST LISTENING TO THIS, AND I WASN'T PLANNING TO BE HERE.

I'M WAITING FOR MY SON AND I WON'T BE AT THE COUNCIL, BUT YOU HAVE I-35 FRONTAGE OR OLD TOWN OVERLAY.

[01:40:08]

AS A QUALIFIER, CITY MARKET WOULD BE IN THE SUPPLEMENTAL REGULATIONS WOULD QUALIFY.

RIGHT. SO JUST TO CLARIFY, SUPPLEMENTAL REGULATIONS APPLY TO ANY LIQUOR STORE REGARDLESS OF LOCATION.

RIGHT. RIGHT.

SO BUT IN BY DOING THAT WHEN WE'RE TAKING THAT INTO AN ACCOUNT CITY MARKET FOR EXAMPLE WOULD BE IN THE OLD TOWN OVERLAY.

SO THEY WOULD BE RESTRICTED FROM BEING ABLE TO SELL ALCOHOL.

CORRECT. THAT IS NOT CORRECT.

OKAY. THAT'S WHY I WAS ASKING. THEY WOULD HAVE TO GET AN SUP.

SO THEY WOULD NEED COUNCIL APPROVAL TO DO A LIQUOR STORE IN THE OLD TOWN OVERLAY.

SO JUST TO CLARIFY A LITTLE FURTHER, THE STATE OF TEXAS DOES NOT ALLOW GROCERY STORES OR OTHER RETAIL STORE ESTABLISHMENTS TO SELL ALCOHOL AS A PACKAGED STORE IF THAT LAW CHANGED, THIS HYPOTHETICAL COULD COME INTO PLAY, BUT AT THIS MOMENT IN TIME, THE STATE DOES NOT ALLOW FOR THOSE TYPES OF SALES IN THOSE ESTABLISHMENTS.

OKAY. SO THAT AND THAT MIGHT ANSWER MY QUESTION RIGHT THERE.

SO THEN IF WE TAKE H-E-B, RIGHT.

SO H-E-B WHO SELLS BEER AND WINE, THEY WOULD NOT ALSO BE ALLOWED TO SELL LIQUOR.

THAT IS CORRECT. OKAY.

CURRENTLY IF THE LAW CHANGED AND THEY WANTED TO SELL LIQUOR, THEY WOULD HAVE TO HAVE A ESSENTIALLY A SEPARATE BUILDING.

IT COULDN'T YOU COULDN'T GO INTO ATB CURRENT BUILDING TO BUY LIQUOR.

YOU'D HAVE TO GO INTO A SEPARATE ENTRANCE.

OKAY. WHICH WOULD BE MAYBE IT'S CALLED ATB LIQUORS, AND THIS IS ASSUMING THE LAW CHANGED.

IT WOULD BE A PARTITIONED SEPARATE BUILDING, SEPARATE ENTRANCE, AND THAT'S A THAT'S A STATE LAW.

RIGHT. OKAY. SO IF IT'S EXISTING BUILDINGS RIGHT NOW OR LIKE WE'LL SAY HOBBY LOBBY OR SOMEONE GAVE ANOTHER EXAMPLE OF A BIG RETAIL ESTABLISHMENT.

SURE. HOBBY LOBBY. YEAH.

OKAY. SO THEY WOULD BE ABLE TO GO IN AND CREATE A LIQUOR STORE ESSENTIALLY OUT OF THAT RETAIL SPACE IF THEY TOOK THEIR BUILDING.

RIGHT, AND THEY HAD THE ZONING AND THEY MET ALL THE SUPPLEMENTS.

SO IF THEY TOOK THEIR CURRENT BUILDING, LET'S SAY THEIR CURRENT BUILDING IS 100,000FT², RIGHT? AND THEY PARTITIONED OFF, PUT IN A PERMANENT WALL AND MADE A SEPARATE 7500 SQUARE FOOT BUILDING WITH ITS OWN ENTRANCES, ITS OWN EVERYTHING.

RIGHT. IT'S A SEPARATE BUSINESS AT THAT POINT AND WANTED TO CALL IT HOBBY LOBBY LIQUORS, THEN THEY COULD, THEY COULD DO THAT, BUT YOU WOULD NOT BE ABLE TO ACCESS THE LIQUOR STORE FROM HOBBY LOBBY PROPER.

IT WOULD BE A SEPARATE ENTITY, PARTITIONED SEPARATE INSTRUMENTS, AND IT WOULD HAVE TO MEET ALL THESE SUPPLEMENTAL REGULATIONS.

OKAY. SO AND THAT'S THE CRUX OF THE QUESTION, ESPECIALLY FROM LIKE A LAND USE PERSPECTIVE, WHAT WOULD BE THAT ZONING CHANGE? LET'S SAY HOBBY LOBBY CLOSED DOWN AND SAYS OH MY GOODNESS, TOTAL WINE WANTS TO COME IN.

WOULD THEY WOULD BE ABLE BY RIGHT BECAUSE IT WOULD FALL UNDER, I GUESS IT WOULD FALL UNDER COMMERCIAL RIGHT UNDER THESE NEW IF ADOPTED AS PROPOSED, LET'S SAY HOBBY LOBBY IS GENERAL RETAIL. JUST HYPOTHETICALLY, I THINK IT MAY BE.

I'M SO SORRY Y'ALL.

NO, NO THAT'S FINE.

IT'S A GOOD QUESTION. SO LET'S SAY HYPOTHETICALLY, THE HOBBY LOBBY MET ALL THE SUPPLEMENTAL REGULATIONS.

I TELL YOU, THEY'D HAVE TO GO PUT IN SOME TREES IN A BUFFER.

THEY DON'T HAVE THAT, BUT WE'LL GET ON THAT IF THEY MET EVERYTHING ELSE.

SURE AND THIS WAS ADOPTED AS PROPOSED THEN? BY RIGHT, THEY COULD OPEN.

THAT COULD BECOME A TOTAL WINE.

THE DAY AFTER THIS, A DAY AFTER LOCAL ELECTION AND ALL THE RIGHT IF IT WERE RIGHT.

SO WE'RE PLAYING IT IN THEORY.

IF IT WERE IN THEORY.

OKAY. SO THEN THESE SUPPLEMENTAL REGULATIONS IN THEORY WOULD APPLY TO EVEN EXISTING FRONTAGE RETAIL THAT WE HAVE RIGHT NOW.

THAT IS CORRECT. WOULD NOT MANDATE THE CONSTRUCTION OF A NEW BUILDING.

A NEW BUILDING WOULD BE HAVE TO BE BUILT TO MEET THESE AS WELL.

SO THESE SUPPLEMENTAL REGULATIONS WOULD APPLY TO EXISTING AND FUTURE AND FUTURE.

EVERYBODY WOULD TREAT THEM THE SAME.

RIGHT, AND BUT IT WILL BE INTEGRATED.

SO IT COULD BE EXISTING AND OR A NEW BUILDING.

THAT IS CORRECT. RIGHT. OKAY.

THAT WAS IT. THAT WAS THOSE WERE THE ONLY QUESTIONS I HAD.

NO WORRIES GOOD QUESTIONS AND THAT'S ALL PREFACED.

IF THIS WAS ADOPTED AS PROPOSED, COUNCIL MAY SAY WE WANT IT TO BE AN SUP FOR EVERYTHING, OR MAYBE WE'RE ONLY GOING TO ALLOW THEM, AND SO IF ADOPTED AS PRESENTED. ANY OTHER CLARIFICATIONS OR QUESTIONS ON THAT? ALL RIGHT. SO WE HAVE A COUPLE MORE SLIDES.

SO I-35 DESIGN STANDARDS.

SO ESSENTIALLY WHAT THIS IS TELLING YOU IS WE PROCESS A LOT OF WAIVERS TO THE I-35 DESIGN STANDARDS.

A LOT OF THEM ARE NOT APPLICABLE TO THE TYPE OF DEVELOPMENT THAT WE'RE SEEING OCCUR, AND IT'S BECOME A BURDEN REALLY ON SOME OF THE DEVELOPERS AND THE CURRENT LAND USES.

SO WHAT WE'VE PROPOSED IS THAT I-35 INTERSTATE COMMERCIAL ZONING DISTRICT THAT'S ALL KIND OF SAYING THAT WE'RE GOING TO MOVE THE APPLICABLE STANDARDS THAT WE CARE ABOUT SOME LANDSCAPING AND PARKING SCREENING INTO THE BASE ZONING DISTRICT, AND GET RID OF THE REST OF THAT I-35 OVERLAY AND I-35 DESIGN STANDARDS.

WE'RE GOING TO SIMPLIFY IT FOR LAND OWNERS AND PROSPECTIVE NEW BUSINESSES THAT COME INTO THE CITY SO THIS IS A KIND OF A SLIDE TO SHOW YOU THAT

[01:45:07]

ONE THING I'LL KIND OF POINT OUT IS THIS GARAGE GRAPHIC.

SO THAT'S A PROPOSAL KIND OF TO THE KIND OF TWO THINGS THAT IT DOES A LITTLE BIT OF WIDER LOT HELPS WITH DRAINAGE CONCERNS AND SOME OF THESE THINGS AS YOU START PUTTING AC PADS AND DRIVEWAYS IN. SO A LITTLE BIT OF A WIDER LOT CREATES A MORE ESTHETIC STREET VIEW THESE DRIVEWAYS, DE-EMPHASIZE THE GARAGES.

MAYBE YOU'VE HEARD THE TERMS ABOUT GARAGES, SNOUT NOSE HOUSES AND IT CREATES MORE WHERE THE EMPHASIS IS ON THE FRONT PORCH.

IT'S ON THE PEDESTRIAN, IT'S ON THE FRONT OF THE HOUSE, NOT ON THE GARAGE.

IT ALSO GETS SOME OF THESE PEOPLE THAT HAVE THE F 18, 750 I DON'T KNOW WHAT NUMBERS THEY GO UP TO THESE DAYS.

IT IT CREATES A LONGER DRIVEWAY, SO YOU HAVE LESS OF THOSE STICKING OUT INTO YOUR SIDEWALKS AND YOUR PEDESTRIAN AREAS SO THAT'S THE INTENT OF THE THAT GRAPHIC YOU SEE THERE WE'VE ALSO CONSOLIDATED OUR MULTIFAMILY ONE AND TWO DISTRICTS INTO JUST MULTIFAMILY WE'VE DECREASED THE MAXIMUM DENSITY FROM 24 PER ACRE DOWN TO 18 DWELLING UNITS PER ACRE SO A LITTLE LESS, AND THEN IF ANYBODY WANTED A GREATER DENSITY THAN THAT, THEY WOULD HAVE TO PROPOSE A PLAN DEVELOPMENT.

SO WE COULD EXTRACT THE KIND OF THINGS THAT WE WANT TO SEE FOR THAT DEVELOPMENT IN LIEU OF GETTING SOME GREATER DENSITY, BUT THE BY RIGHT WOULD BE 18 DWELLING UNITS PER ACRE. ONE QUICK QUESTION.

YEAH, WE'VE HAD A COUPLE OF THINGS COME BEFORE US BEFORE ON ACREAGE.

YES. IT HAS TO BE A CERTAIN SIZE BEFORE YOU CAN ADD A SECOND UNIT SECOND BUILDING, LIVABLE BUILDING.

IS THAT GOING TO BE MODIFIED? ANYTHING WITH THESE CHANGES? SO THE ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS I COVERED A FEW SLIDES AGO MAYBE WE KIND OF GLOSSED OVER THAT A LITTLE BIT, BUT IT'S REAL QUICK AND I DIDN'T WANT TO.

SO ESSENTIALLY WHAT THEY WOULD DO IS THEY WOULD BE ALLOWED IN THE UH, CURRENTLY THEY'RE ALLOWED IN AGRICULTURAL SF-10, SF-16 AND SF-E SO THAT'S ONLY LOTS THAT THEY'RE ALLOWED IN.

THEY WOULDN'T BE ALLOWED IN AN SF 8.5 BECAUSE OF THE LOT SIZE.

WE DON'T BELIEVE IT WOULD BE APPROPRIATE, AND I DO WISH THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN 10,000FT².

I WOULD LOVE TO SEEN 10,000, BUT I KNOW THAT BACKLASH WOULD HAVE HAPPENED.

WE ARE PROPOSING 8.5 AS THE MINIMUM DWELLING UNIT SIZE FOR BASE ZONING.

SO IF SOMEBODY WANTED TO YOU HAVE DISCRETION IN ZONING.

SO IF IN A CERTAIN AREA YOU FELT THAT SF-10 WAS MORE APPROPRIATE, YOU STILL HAVE THE SF-10 AT YOUR DISPOSABLE AS A ZONING DISTRICT TO APPROVE.

ALL RIGHT. SO THIS KIND OF TALKS ABOUT THE EXISTING ZONING.

SO I KIND OF ALLUDED TO SF-7 BECOMES WHAT WE CALL A LEGACY DISTRICT.

SO IT DOESN'T CREATE THESE NON-CONFORMING ISSUES.

ANY REQUESTS FOR GREATER DENSITY YOU'D SEE AS A PD.

SAME THING YOU SEE THERE AS A MULTIFAMILY ALREADY COVERED WE DO HAVE A COUPLE OTHER SUPPLEMENTAL REGULATIONS.

ONE OF THOSE SPECIFICALLY I'LL TOUCH ON IS CAR WASH ORIENTATION.

SO WE'RE PROPOSING FOR A QUICK VEHICLE SERVICING AS AN SUP AND GENERAL RETAIL AND BY RIGHT WITH SUPPLEMENTAL REGULATIONS AND COMMERCIAL INTERSTATE, COMMERCIAL INDUSTRIAL SO THE CAR WASH ORIENTATION, THAT ESSENTIALLY MEANS THAT THEY'RE GOING TO RUN CAR WASHES THAT BE RUN PARALLEL TO THE ROAD.

SO AS YOU'RE DRIVING DOWN, YOU'RE NOT SEEING PEOPLE COME IN AND OUT YOU'RE SEEING THE SIDE OF THE CAR WASH.

PEOPLE ARE COMING IN FROM THE AUXILIARY SIDE.

SO THEY HAVE TO HAVE INSTEAD OF SQUEEZING CAR WASHES IN SOME OF THESE TINY LITTLE LOTS, THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE TO FIND LOTS THAT ARE A LITTLE WIDER IS ALL THAT TO SAY THAT.

SO THAT'S JUST A SUPPLEMENTAL REGULATION INDUSTRIAL.

SO I KIND OF ALLUDED TO WE'RE NOT ALLOWING SOBS BY.

RIGHT. THEY HAVE TO USE AN SUP AND THEN YOU HAVE BETTER DISTRICTS.

SO IF SOMETHING FITS MORE IN A BUSINESS PARK DESIGN, YOU NOW HAVE A BUSINESS PARK ZONING.

IF IT'S A TRUE INDUSTRIAL USE, WE CAN ZONE IT INDUSTRIAL WITHOUT HAVING TO WORRY ABOUT THE SOBS BEING BY RIGHT AND THEY'RE NOT GOING TO LOSE ANY OTHER BY RIGHT USES THE OVERLAYS, THEY WOULD CEASE TO EXIST.

THOSE STANDARDS ARE GOING TO BE MOVED INTO THE BASELINE ZONING.

SO ALL THE STANDARDS THAT ARE BUSINESS PARK DESIGN STANDARDS, THEY'RE JUST GOING TO BE IN ONE AREA IN THE ZONING DISTRICT.

SO CURRENTLY IF YOU WANT TO DO SOMETHING IN OUR BUSINESS PARK OVERLAY, YOU HAVE TO LOOK AT STANDARDS IN THE INDUSTRIAL DISTRICT, THE OVERLAY AND THE DESIGN STANDARDS.

SO YOU'RE LOOKING IN INCLUDING ALL THE AUXILIARY SECTIONS, MAYBE EIGHT SECTIONS OF THE CODE.

NOW IT'LL BE IN ONE AREA.

SO IT'S JUST TO BE MORE USER FRIENDLY PLANNED DEVELOPMENT.

I KIND OF ALLUDED TO THIS. WE JUST ESTABLISHED LANGUAGE FOR WHAT OUR EXPECTATIONS ARE FOR THOSE SPECIFICALLY, THERE'S GOT TO BE A BENEFIT TO THE PUBLIC.

IF YOU'RE GOING TO WANT TO USE A PLANNED DEVELOPMENT, IT SHOULD BE A UNIQUE DEVELOPMENT OR A COMBINATION OF COMPLEMENTARY USES THAT YOU COULDN'T ALREADY DO WITH A BASE ZONING

[01:50:03]

THE INTENT IS TO DO A PD TO GET SOMETHING THAT'S UNIQUE OR NOT SPECIFIC TO A SECTION OF THE CODE AND THEN WE JUST HAVE SOME THESE ARE JUST ADMINISTRATIVE THINGS TO MODIFY WHAT WE WANT TO SEE WHEN WE GET THOSE.

SO A LOT OF TIMES YOU'RE SEEING PDS THAT ARE VERY CONCEPTUAL.

SO WE JUST WANT TO GET THAT THERE'S SOME MORE SUPPORTING DOCUMENTS.

SO YOU HAVE A LITTLE MORE CLARITY ON WHAT'S BEING PROPOSED AS A BODY.

SO THIS IS KIND OF JUST TALKING ABOUT IN GENERAL CONCEPT, COMPREHENSIVE MAP UPDATE VERSUS A TEXT ONLY ZONING CODE UPDATE.

SO AS WE'VE GONE THROUGH, THERE'S A COUPLE WAYS WE COULD DO THIS.

WE COULD UPDATE THE ZONING MAP WITH TEXT OR YOU COULD DO A JUST TEXT UPDATE.

SO WHEN YOU DO A TEXT ONLY UPDATE, IT DOESN'T PHYSICALLY ESTABLISH ANY OF THESE NEW ZONING DISTRICTS.

IT JUST MAKES THEM AVAILABLE TO BE REQUESTED AND ASSIGNED SO THEY WOULD STILL HAVE TO DO A ZONING CHANGE, REQUIRE NOTICING FOR THOSE, BUT THOSE DISTRICTS WOULDN'T APPEAR ON ANY MAP UNTIL SOMEONE REQUESTS IT COMPREHENSIVE MAP UPDATE WOULD ALLOW COUNCIL TO ACTUALLY REZONE CERTAIN EXISTING ZONING DISTRICTS AT THE TIME OF ADOPTION.

SO ONE IS WE'VE UPDATED THE TEXT ONLY.

IT'S STILL A ZONING CHANGE. WE'RE STILL NOTICING, BUT WE'RE NOT PHYSICALLY CHANGING THE ZONING OF ANY PROPERTY.

THE OTHER IS WE'RE LOOKING AT THE MAP AND WE'RE VERY CALCULATED, CHANGING SOME PARCELS TO THE MORE APPROPRIATE ZONING AND THAT IS WHAT THIS--THAT IS WHAT THIS SLIDE IS ESSENTIALLY TELLING YOU, AND ANYTHING THAT WASN'T CONFORMING ALREADY WOULD BE LEGAL, NONCONFORMING, AND WOULD BE ALLOWED TO CONTINUE TO OPERATE.

SO NOT SHUTTERING ANYBODY'S DOORS WITH EITHER OPTION.

SO THESE ARE SOME AREAS THAT WE KIND OF LOOKED AT JUST THE STAFF LEVEL AND KIND OF PRESENTED THAT COULD BE REZONED.

SO WE KIND OF FOCUSED OUR EFFORTS ON THE I-35 AREA.

WE HAVE A LOT OF PROPERTIES THAT WOULD SPECIFICALLY YOU SEE DOWN TO THE SOUTH, THAT YELLOW CLUSTER.

SO THAT'S YOUR BUSINESS PARK OVERLAY.

SO THOSE ARE JUST BEING REZONED TO BUSINESS PARK DOESN'T REALLY CHANGE ANYTHING FOR THEM SOME OTHERS ARE SOME AG AND COMMERCIAL SPLIT PROPERTIES CLEANING UP THE ZONING.

WE'RE LOOKING AT SOME TEN PARCELS THAT ARE INDUSTRIAL, DOWNGRADING THEM TO COMMERCIAL BECAUSE THOSE USES ARE ALREADY A COMMERCIAL USE.

THEY JUST HAVE A MORE INTENSIVE ZONING THAN THE USE THAT EXISTS.

SO WE'RE ALIGNING THE ZONING WITH THE USE AND THEN YOU SEE SOME INTERSTATE COMMERCIAL.

IT IT WOULD JUST ACTUALLY, IN A LOT OF CASES, GIVE THEM MORE USES AT THEIR DISPOSAL, AND IT CLEANS UP THE ZONING TO A MORE APPROPRIATE CATEGORY, AND THEN WE CURRENTLY HAVE 42 PARCELS.

WE WOULD KEEP 13 OF THOSE AS INDUSTRIAL TRUE INDUSTRIALS WE LOOK AT MAYBE MAKING THOSE 11 OF THOSE INTERSTATE COMMERCIAL TEND TO COMMERCIAL AND THE EIGHT TO BUSINESS PARK. THAT'S JUST TO ALIGN THE EXISTING USE WITH THE PROPOSED ZONING DISTRICT.

IF WE DID A MAP UPDATE, AND THEN WE LOOKED AT WILTSHIRE.

SO THIS IS KIND OF THE SAME THING.

WE LOOKED AT TAKING SOME OF THESE COMMERCIAL USES THAT ALLOW MORE INTENSIVE USES BY RIGHT, AND MAKING THEM GENERAL RETAIL.

SO THEY'RE MORE OF THE TYPE OF DEVELOPMENT THAT WE CURRENTLY SEE OCCURRING ON WILTSHIRE, SUCH AS THE SUMMER CREST PROJECTS, AND, YOU KNOW, ALL OUR DIFFERENT THE THINGS THAT ARE YOU'RE CURRENTLY SEEING HAPPEN ON WILTSHIRE.

SO IT'S JUST ALIGNING THAT TO MAKE THOSE USES FIT IN LINE WITH WHAT WE'RE SEEING.

SO THIS IS SOME NOTICING REQUIREMENTS.

SO SOME OF THIS THIS IS GOING TO ALLUDE TO A SENATE BILL THAT WAS PASSED IN THIS LAST LEGISLATIVE YEAR AND IT REQUIRES US ESSENTIALLY WITH A STANDARD.

WE HAVE TO NOTICE NOT ONLY THE PROPERTY OWNER BUT THE TENANT.

SO WHAT THAT MEANS IS ESSENTIALLY FOR IF WE WOULD HAVE HAD TO SEND OUT 500 NOTICES, NOW WE'RE GOING TO SEND OUT 1000 BECAUSE WE HAVE TO SEND ONE TO THE TAX COUNTY OWNER OF RECORD AND ALSO THE PHYSICAL ADDRESS TO GET THE TENANT.

SO THAT'S JUST FOR YOUR INFORMATION, THAT NOTICING WILL BE THERE'LL BE A GREATER AMOUNT OF PEOPLE NOTICED BASED OFF THAT LAW.

SO THESE ARE KIND OF OUR NEXT STEPS.

SO THE NEXT STEP MOST LIKELY WILL BE BRINGING FORWARD THE LIQUOR STORE PROPOSAL TEXT AMENDMENT.

JUST SO WE HAVE THAT IN PLACE SHOULD A LOCAL ELECTION OCCUR, AND THEN AFTER THAT WE'RE GOING TO BE DOING A LOT OF OUR COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT, OUR FEEDBACK WITH THE PUBLIC AND OUR STAKEHOLDERS, AND THAT WILL OCCUR BEFORE THE ZONING CODE UPDATE.

THIS IS NOT THE LIQUOR STORE TAX.

THIS IS THE ZONING CODE UPDATE THAT WILL OCCUR BEFORE IT COMES BACK TO YOU FOR CONSIDERATION AND THEN PHASE TWO, THEY WOULD GO TO PLANNING ZONING AND CITY COUNCIL, AND THEN PHASE THREE IS WHERE WE'RE GOING TO BRING FORWARD THE OTHER PORTIONS OF THE CODE.

SO WE DON'T WANT TO THESE PORTIONS I WILL SAY, ARE WRITTEN AND READY TO GO, BUT WE WANT TO MAKE IT MANAGEABLE.

SO THE NEXT PHASE WILL BE UPDATES TO THE LANDSCAPING, FENCING AND SCREENING AND THE SIGN CODE.

[01:55:06]

SO THERE MAY BE MINOR TEXT AMENDMENTS THROUGHOUT THE FIRST, YOU KNOW, 6 TO 18 MONTHS OF THE CODE JUST TO CLEAN UP PROCESSES OR A TYPO OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, AND STAFF WOULD CONTINUE TO BE ONGOING WITH THAT, AND I'M WILLING TO ANSWER ANY MORE QUESTIONS THAT YOU HAVE ABOUT ANYTHING THAT WE'VE DISCUSSED WITH THE SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENCES. THERE'S A HOUSE THAT'S WITHIN A BLOCK OF ME THAT HAS THE REGULAR INITIAL HOUSE.

THEN IT HAS A SEPARATE TWO STORY ADDITION.

I THINK AT ONE TIME IT IT DID HAVE A THOROUGH PASS THROUGH IT SINGLE FAMILY UNDERSTAND THE SINGLE FAMILY, UNDERSTAND THAT PEOPLE HAVE GROWN KIDS AND GRANDKIDS AND STUFF THAT MOVE IN, BUT WHAT HAPPENS WHEN PEOPLE LIKE THAT START DOING THREE SEPARATE FAMILIES LIVING IN.

SURE. SO THAT'S THE ADUS.

WE THAT'S SOME OF THE THINGS THAT WE PROVIDED IN HERE OUR LANGUAGE.

SO I WILL TELL YOU, CODE ENFORCEMENT, SOME OF THOSE THINGS CAN GET TRICKY TO ENFORCE.

I'LL JUST BE HONEST UNLESS YOU'RE GOING IN THERE AND ASKING FOR BIRTH CERTIFICATES AND MARRIAGE CERTIFICATES, IT CAN BE, IT CAN BE DIFFICULT.

THAT BEING SAID, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE THESE THE ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS CAN ONLY HAVE A KITCHENETTE, SO NOT A FULL KITCHEN SO SO THAT'S PART OF IT.

THEY HAVE TO BE IF YOU LOOK IN HERE, THE PRIMARY RESIDENCE SHALL BE OCCUPIED BY THE PROPERTY OWNER, SO THAT HELPS.

SO IT'S NOT LIKE SOMEBODY IN ANOTHER STATE OWNS THIS, AND THEY KEEP PUTTING ADUS ON IT, AND THEN, YOU KNOW, THEY HAVE TO ACTUALLY RESIDE IN THE PRIMARY RESIDENCE THE ACCESSORY STRUCTURE DWELLING HAS TO BE SUBORDINATE IN HEIGHT AND SIZE THE MINIMUM LOT SIZE FOR AN ADU IS 10,000FT² ONE ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT PER LOT, AND THEN IT'S LIMITED TO REGULATIONS AS PER THE ADOPTED BUILDING CODE.

SO THE BUILDING CODE HAS SOME LANGUAGE IN THERE ABOUT WHAT THAT MEANS WHEN YOU KIND OF ALLUDE TO FAMILY.

SO WE ALSO HAVE LANGUAGE THAT SAYS SHALL NOT BE SUBLEASED OR RENTED.

SO THE INTENT IS IF YOU HAVE AN ADU, IT'S FOR YOUR SON IN COLLEGE, YOUR DAUGHTER AND HER BRAND NEW HUSBAND THAT ARE JUST GETTING ON THEIR FEET, YOUR YOUR MOTHER WHO'S RETIRED AND CAN'T AFFORD TO PAY TAXES ANYMORE.

SO IT'S NOT.

INTENDED TO BE SUB-LISTED, AND WE HAVE THAT IN THE CODE.

SO IT'S ENFORCEABLE BY CODE ENFORCEMENT, AND THAT'S WHAT I WOULD ASSUME.

I'M GUESSING IT'S PROBABLY AT LEAST A THE REGULAR HOUSE IS PROBABLY 1800 SQUARE FEET.

THE ADDITION FOOTPRINT IS PROBABLY ABOUT 1200 1300 PLUS ANOTHER ONE ON TOP.

YEAH. SO YOU KNOW WE ALSO PUT IN HERE NO SEPARATE UTILITY METERS.

SO THAT SQUASHES A LOT OF THAT RIGHT.

YEAH I THINK IT'S JUST ONE UNIT.

I'M SURE THEY'RE JUST SPLITTING IT.

YEAH. SO THERE'S ALWAYS GOING TO BE PEOPLE THAT ARE GOING TO FIND WAYS TO CIRCUMVENT CODES.

THESE STANDARDS HAVE BEEN USED.

THESE ARE, YOU KNOW, BEEN USED IN SOME OTHER CITIES I'VE WORKED AT, AND THEY SEEM TO CURTAIL A LOT OF THOSE CONCERNS THAT'S NOT TO SAY SOMEONE'S NOT SMART ENOUGH TO FIGURE OUT A WAY TO CIRCUMVENT THAT, BUT THIS WOULD PREVENT THEM FROM ESSENTIALLY GETTING A SECOND ADDRESS, A SECOND WATER METER, A FULL KITCHEN.

THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE A KITCHENETTE, NOT A FULL KITCHEN.

SO IT SEVERELY LIMITS WHAT THAT ADU CAN LOOK LIKE NOW, ONES THAT ARE ALREADY EXISTING, THAT ARE LEGAL, NON-CONFORMING THEY'RE THERE, BUT THIS IS FOR NEW ADU PERMITS THAT COME IN.

WE DON'T REALLY HAVE ANY STANDARDS RELATED TO THOSE CURRENTLY.

SO THIS IS TO PROVIDE US SOME GUIDELINES AND STANDARDS SO THAT WE CAN BETTER POLICE THOSE EFFORTS NOW, AND ONE OTHER THING LIKE I SAID, I'M GENERAL CONTRACTOR.

I'M IN AND OUT ALL OVER THIS TOWN AND OTHER TOWNS AND STUFF.

YOU ALWAYS HEAR ABOUT THE THE FAMILY QUIET STREET.

THERE'S MHMR HOUSE, AND I UNDERSTAND PEOPLE NEED HELP AND ALL THAT STUFF, BUT THEN YOU ALWAYS HEAR THE HORROR STORIES WHERE SOMEBODY CLIMBED OUT A WINDOW, [INAUDIBLE] A FENCE GOING DOWN THE STREET WITH A KNIFE IN HER HAND.

WHAT'S TO PROTECT? SO SOME OF THOSE THINGS THAT YOU'RE TALKING ARE PROTECTED.

SO THOSE ARE DIFFERENT.

SO SOME OF THESE THIS ADU IS NOT AFFECTED BY, IT'S NOT AFFECTED BY THAT.

SO THERE ARE CERTAIN FEDERAL STATE LAWS THAT WE ARE BOUND TO BY WHERE THOSE CAN GO AND HOW THOSE COULD BE.

THERE'S A SUPREME COURT CASE, CLEBURNE, YEAH, IN THE 80S HAD ONE WHERE THEY GOT SUED.

VERY SIMILAR. IT'S RIGHT NEXT TO WHAT USED TO BE THE HIGH SCHOOL IS NOW THE IT'S NOT THE COURTHOUSE, IT'S BUT IT'S WHERE THEY HAVE ALL THE CASES.

THAT'S THE OLD HIGH SCHOOL FROM WAY BACK WHEN.

IT'S RIGHT ACROSS IT THAT'S A GOOD CASE TO GO LOOK AT CLEBURNE VERSUS, YOU KNOW, SUPREME SO SOME OF THOSE THINGS WE CAN'T REGULATE.

SO THAT'S WHY WE HAVE POLICE AND CODE ENFORCEMENT FOR SOME OF THE ISSUES, BUT ZONING CODE CAN ONLY DO SO MUCH, IF YOU WILL.

[02:00:01]

YEAH. WE DON'T WANT TO RUN AFOUL OF ANY INVALIDATE OUR ENTIRE CODE, SO WE HAVE TO BE REAL CAREFUL.

YEAH. THE MY FIRST YEAR LAW SCHOOL IN CON LAW ONE OF THE CASES YOU READ, AT LEAST I READ DURING THE BACK OF THE TOWARDS THE END OF SEMESTER WAS ABOUT THE CITY OF CLEVELAND TRYING TO, THROUGH THEIR ZONING ORDINANCE LAND USE REGULATION AND CONTROL, HOUSES.

MHMR HOUSES, SUPREME COURT, UNITED STATES CASE, AND THEY GOT DROP-KICKED ACROSS THE COURTROOM.

IT WAS AN EARLY LESSON THAT ALL LAW STUDENTS LEARN THAT YEAH YOU DON'T DO THAT.

WE DON'T WANT TO BE THERE. WE DON'T WANT TO MAKE ANY CASE LAW TEXTBOOKS.

NOT THAT THEY MAKE TEXTBOOKS ANYMORE, BUT YOU KNOW WHAT I'M SAYING.

BUT PART OF THE ADU STANDARDS IS TO.

PROVIDE SOME GUIDELINES AND SOME STANDARDS AND PREVENT SOME, MAYBE NOT WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT, BUT SOME OTHER POTENTIAL NUISANCES.

ANY MORE QUESTIONS? IF YOU THINK OF SOMETHING AFTER THE FACT.

MY CONTACTS OBVIOUSLY ON THE STAFF REPORT.

SO, YOU KNOW, REACH OUT AND AND YOU CAN ANSWER.

I'LL DO MY BEST TO ANSWER IT AND IF NOT, I'LL FIND SOMEONE SMARTER THAN ME TO ANSWER IT FOR ME.

I APPRECIATE STAFF'S TIME WITH ALL THIS.

LIKE I SAID, THESE ARE QUESTIONS I HEAR FROM CUSTOMERS MYSELF, MY OWN CONCERNS.

SOME OF THESE NAKED PEOPLE YOU DON'T WANT TO SEE KIND OF TO ADD TO THAT, IF YOU DO REACH OUT TO STAFF, PLEASE JUST INCLUDE STAFF MEMBERS, NOT THE REST OF THE COMMISSIONERS, SO THAT WE DON'T VIOLATE A ROLLING QUORUM.

THAT'S CORRECT, I WILL.

ALL RIGHT. THANKS, LIDON.

I APPRECIATE YOUR WORK ON IT.

THANK YOU. ALL RIGHT.

I THINK THAT'LL DO IT FOR REPORTS AND PRESENTATIONS.

THERE'S NO COMMUNITY INTEREST ITEMS, NO EXECUTIVE SESSION.

SO I WILL ADJOURN THE MEETING AT 8:02 P.M..

* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.